Off topic reference the iron crosses that is what we spoke of specifically. My understanding what he related to me was ........after the initial Original hordes he found and sold he was requested to make or have made new ones and he later provided the same . I don’t see the difference.
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Last edited by Dennis S; 02-28-2018, 10:55 PM. -
Back to the pink business , although I find Owen irrating at times but not specifcly to me .
In his defense as a collector he has provided three excellent threads on SS camo smocks, covers and caps that I think were a direct link from the pink discussions
Owen won’t budge off his opinion and that’s that .
I find a couple of other “Johnny come latelys”a little weird in their posts and of no worth to this discussion.
As I reiterated in the past there is still lack of a true smoking gun or hard evidence in support of the smocks. That said I feel the circumstantial evidence from the Floch discussions have reinforced the pro camp to a degree.
It’s like a criminal case ....statements alone have little weight but if they are corraberated by other evidence it gives them a bit more weight.
The case is not closed because the jury is still out.
As far as the smocks jumping to a price of a German industries made one you will never see that value no matter what evidence or smoking gun is found . They will always be regulated quite lower value like the Italian camo pieces especially the field tailor or custom ones. imho .Last edited by Dennis S; 02-28-2018, 10:56 PM.Comment
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I agree.
The birch smocks won't ever see the same price as accepted German manufactured smocks - but I don't think that that is what anyone defending (or at least trying to sort the truth out) is in this for. It's a case of saving history from the rubbish bin, as has depressingly been seen when 'popular vote' goes against an item that is condemned because people haven't got enough common sense to say that maybe they just don't know....
Mark
NZComment
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Hi Nutmeg,
Did Floch know he was going to be interviewed about the smocks before he arrived at the show?
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He did not. I had my friend (who has met him in the past and Floch knows him) write him a letter months ago asking some of the questions but he never answered , so after finding out he was at SOS every year I prepared the questions and he was approached directly. He was forthcoming and happy to answer all the questions without proddingOriginally posted by Sonderkommando View Post
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Originally posted by NZMark View Post
Do you know?
I say what I said before: I think it's possible these were made after the war for some Eastern European army. To me they are not ww2 made items. And Mr. Floch and his "strong evidence" is not good enough for me. Anyhow not enough to overcome the many problems these smocks have.
If the items were made according to accepted standards no interview and / or additional proof would be needed.
CheersComment
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or Western?Comment
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Forgive me if this question has been posed before, but do comparative examples of other SS garments exist?
i.e. If these smocks were made in reasonable quantities for the post-war Soviet film industry, then it's fair to assume SS Dot 44 jackets, pants, wraps, and all the other types were also manufactured, no?
If so, they would show similarities in material quality, print method, construction, labels, stamps, you name it.
Where are they?Comment
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No, it is not a fair assumption IMO. The appearance of one item does not mean that pattern was replicated in factory production for all SS garment types.Originally posted by CPB View Post
s/f RobertComment
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Originally posted by Sonderkommando View Post
No , I had not had a conversation with him in at least 25 years plus.Comment
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Mosfilm said they were incapable of making anything like this and if you saw what self made crap they had in inventory you would believe it. These are exact clones of standard SS smocks except for a few minor details like the color of the pocket hbt, thread , etc. Film company costumes do not require even close to the level detail required on pink/birch smocks. It just has to look good on film.Originally posted by CPB View PostComment
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No - Obviously Not. But neither do you, just as obviously.Originally posted by Fritz View Post
Which is why serious research to try to determine (one way or the other) if these stand a chance of being WWII period items is ongoing.
Mark
NZComment
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Exactly, it just had to look good on film...Look at the smocks used in the movie "a Bridge too far" (1977).Originally posted by nutmeg View Post
In the West there were far less inventories of authentic kit that survived, (simply disposed of...in the East they hoarded it, nothing was thrown out)...
So in the West stuff was created...made up...like these odd looking smocks in the Arnhem Battle classic movie.
These burch/pink smocks have too much in common with (Reich made) text book ones for them to be just simple movie props...Comment
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What if they are fakes for the collector market in the 80ties? Does they qualify then?Originally posted by NickG View PostComment
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