Warning: session_start(): open(/var/cpanel/php/sessions/ea-php74/sess_8209d38a55297bd4b7abe24a28ed08f4f40068005a1a494d, O_RDWR) failed: No space left on device (28) in /home/devwehrmacht/public_html/forums/includes/vb5/frontend/controller/page.php on line 71 Warning: session_start(): Failed to read session data: files (path: /var/cpanel/php/sessions/ea-php74) in /home/devwehrmacht/public_html/forums/includes/vb5/frontend/controller/page.php on line 71 The Coburg Badge - Wehrmacht-Awards.com Militaria Forums
Helmut Weitze

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

The Coburg Badge

Collapse
This is a sticky topic.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

    Yes gentlemen, Hugh has but a short time and I expect to hear from Mary anytime now of his passing. Hugh's passion for the hobby is only exeeded by his honesty and integrity. I only wish that I had been acquainted with him many years ago.

    I was not the lucky person who purchased Eitel's BO grouping, i have no idea who was. Br. James informed me that the BO was sold by Ulric of England close to ten years ago and then again by eMedals several months back. Also, there was a photo album and a 1938 Coburg Commemorative Pokal with engraving on auction several years ago. Hugh told me he purchased the CB while in Europe from a Hermann Historica auction.

    Thank you for all of the kind remarks and compliments guys.

    Concerning the badge, it has obviously been repaired before, perhaps even more than once. Look closely at the sword where the spine on the blade is completely worn away as well as the wear on the laurels, esp. on the bottom. I've never seen this much wear on any other examples I've seen, so Herr Eitel wore this badge a great deal, perhaps daily at some point. Certainly he was very proud wearing it and could have afforded him some "perks" along the way. It has a wonderful tone and hue, esp. under artificial lighting.

    As for the documentation, I believe it gives hints of Eitel possibly receiving the badge later than the 1932 reunion and perhaps not being awarded until a 1933 meeting of recipients in Coburg. Is anyone recognizable in the group shot to you guys? I'd love to know where the photo was taken. Eitel stresses the year 1933 on the framed photo, even going to the trouble to place a mini CB within. To me, this is a clue to when he received the badge. In the photo too, Eitel is seen wearing another badge, which could be the Eckart badge, which by the way was NOT part of the grouping, but was listed for sale at the same time Hugh listed the CB group. I'm just not sure what else it could be. The 1933 RPT badge was not round that year, so it rules that one out.

    Concerning the pink Besitz-Zeugnis (possession document), that is the only part of the grouping that I am not 100% certain about. Of course it is a copy of the nice, embossed certificate and common sense would be that the CB recipients would not carry these on their person, only to be damaged in a short period.
    Yet with the strict enforcement of not allowing Party members who were not officially "Mit Hitler" at Coburg, and the fact that no official Besitz-Zeugnis was issued due to the small amount of 1st pattern badges awarded (436) it does make sense that "something" was used as a physical form of official ownership. The paper is old and at one point the badge was pinned to the top of the sheet leaving an impression of the badge. During this era, small table top presses were used, similar to, but not exactly like the old memiographed copies we used in school in the 1970's. I am not overly concerned about the B-Z document as it is the badge and the other items that make this grouping so special and of main importance. Perhaps someday another will surface or some period documentation will be discovered explaining what was carried "on person."

    Again thank you all for your interest. I'm happy that Erich made it possible to place the grouping along with all of the other fine and beautiful examples shown on this wonderful thread, which has given me many hours of reading enjoyment and a great history lesson.

    Marcus
    Last edited by SMV; 04-23-2016, 11:18 AM.

    Comment


      I'm buying very little anymore and am in more of a selling mode now a days, however this grouping is so awesome I would have parted ways with some money to get it too. I can only hope you can reunite it with his BO and other items to make a killer group that few would not think is the centerpiece of any collection (not that this isn't already). Simply stunning.
      Richard V

      Comment


        I was researching some material in the 1937 SS Statistical Yearbook and came across some interesting information. The yearbook provided the numbers of SS recipients of the Ehrenzeichen der NSDAP: the Golden Party Badge, the Blood Order and the Coburg Badge. By 1937, the Coburg Badge had been awarded to 130 SS members. Of that number, 49 were NCOs and enlisted men and the balance of 81 were officers. That number was distributed among the SS Oberabschnitte, the SS-TV, SS-VT and Special Units.

        Comment


          So Joe, what do you surmise from these figures?

          Comment


            Well after looking through the 1937 SS DAL, I don't think I can make anything out of the figures. Of course the early SS/Stabwache that accompanied Hitler to Coburg like Schaub and Maurice received the CB. But some of the senior SS officers on the list were political heavy weights like Amann and Sauckel. I went through the list only once but couldn't find the 81 officers. I only found half that number. So perhaps there were some situations like Weitzel who received one according to his officer file but it was never shown in the DAL. But there were several SS officers on the DAL with the Coburg Badge marked next to their name, but whose name was not on the OSAF list. A bit confusing.

            Comment


              Originally posted by JoeW View Post
              I was researching some material in the 1937 SS Statistical Yearbook and came across some interesting information. The yearbook provided the numbers of SS recipients of the Ehrenzeichen der NSDAP: the Golden Party Badge, the Blood Order and the Coburg Badge. By 1937, the Coburg Badge had been awarded to 130 SS members. Of that number, 49 were NCOs and enlisted men and the balance of 81 were officers. That number was distributed among the SS Oberabschnitte, the SS-TV, SS-VT and Special Units.
              Hello Joe,

              Interesting statistics. It will be nice to run the same process with BO and GPBs - how many were NCOs and how many were officers. We also know that there were a select few who possessed all 3 esteemed badges.

              Mil

              Comment


                Possibly some could have been honorary awardings?

                Comment


                  Originally posted by ErichS View Post
                  Possibly some could have been honorary awardings?
                  Hello Erich,

                  Do we know how many CBs were honorary awardees? Do we also know when were the 2nd patterns awarded and during which ceremony?

                  Mil

                  Comment


                    Originally posted by Military View Post
                    Hello Erich,

                    Do we know how many CBs were honorary awardees? Do we also know when were the 2nd patterns awarded and during which ceremony?

                    Mil
                    Mil, I don't know how many honor awards were made but two officials who didn't qualify for the 1st pattern badges were Carl Eduard Sachsen U. Gotha and Franz Schwede Coburg. Both were later awarded most likely the 2nd pattern badge.

                    The second pattern badges were most likely created after the stock of the 1st patterns had ran out.

                    Comment


                      Honor Award CBs

                      The title gives me pause. We know that Hitler created the Ehrenhalber Gold Party Badge to reward those for meritorious service to the party/state. And the so-called honorary Blood Order was an expansion of the parameters of the original Blood Order to provide recognition to those in the Old Reich and Austria who had suffered much as had those that died in Munich in 1923.

                      But please someone find some documentation to explain the honorary Coburg Badge other than a theory to explain the RZM style badges. Were the parameters expanded to include any party members who might have been in the city in 1922 or perhaps provided technical assistance (Dietrich and Schwede-Coburg)? How do you explain Weitzel and the others shown on the 1937 SS DAL as having received the award but not making it on the OSAF list? Why hasn't any mention ever been found of the expansion of the parameters of awarding this prestigious badge?

                      Comment


                        Just a side issue, there are 436 1st pattern Coburg, but how many 2nd pattern?

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by chen View Post
                          Just a side issue, there are 436 1st pattern Coburg, but how many 2nd pattern?
                          Is that your opinion? What documentation do you have to substantiate the figures? We don't know the exact number presented in Coburg in 1932. We have an OSAF list but have no idea of the number issued. One source I quoted was 250. Eitel apparently didn't receive his in Coburg in 1932, yet his was the presumed early issue. There is no documentation when as to when and how many of the RZMs were issued.

                          Comment


                            it would be interesting to know how many of the original 1932 issue awards have survived?

                            Comment


                              Yes it will, but no one will know the answer...

                              Maybe estimates in collectors circles within WAF?

                              Mil

                              Comment


                                If you use the figure that 436 1st pattern badges were originally issued in 1932, my guess would be that less than 10% have survived. Of course no one knows for sure but less than 40 1st pattern badges in collections makes sense to me.

                                Comment

                                Users Viewing this Thread

                                Collapse

                                There is currently 0 user online. 0 members and 0 guests.

                                Most users ever online was 10,032 at 08:13 PM on 09-28-2024.

                                Working...
                                X