Hitler uniform

[Leroy]

I should have said a "checkered" past as there seems to be several stories out there about previous ownership and if anything was,or was not added to the group. An example in quotation marks.


"The above photograph dates from 1969 and shows one of the visor caps to which various related depositions and affidavits refer as having been stolen from Ben Lieber together with other items from his Adolf Hitler Collection. The other cap was described as a mouse-grey "stormtrooper" style cap. Although period newspaper articles refer to caps taken from Hitler's Munich apartment by Lieber, none of the accompanying photographs seem to show these caps. In other words, the earliest photographic evidence dates from the end of the 1960s, when the collection had already passed through the hands of dealers whose reputations for passing off fakes and forgeries are well-known to the point of causing merriment amongst collectors. By 1981, when the photograph below appeared in a magazine article, credited to Mohawk Arms, the cap had been somewhat straightened out."


Glenn

And who is the author of the quoted segment above so their credibility can be judged?

I have no horse in this race, but would only like to know where, on either side, the truth stops and the bullsh-t begins.

[Leroy]

Ahh...found it linked in an earlier post: The author of the miitaria.blogspot (whoever that might be). Now, that's a reputable source....

[Bob Coleman]

Your "type of experience" didn't help you with the Emil Maurice grouping or the Hitler tunic you pretend is real..

I at leasst put my real name on every post and do not hide behind a screen name furnishing no bonafides as to either knowledge or experience. Your post does not deserve any response. I am done with this thread.

[blitzkrieg gsd]

Guys don't get mad this is support to be a learning thread. We are here to figure out the facts behind this group. All of a sudden people are getting there feelings hurt. What has happened here?

[BobI]

I think what annoys some of us is those of us who have intricate knowledge of this group and other items share our experience and knowledge. Then, guys who think they are trying to be analytic question what was never questioned before. I can give several examples of this; for example the die flawed S+L RK. So, it does get annoying.
Happy New Year!
Bob

[BrianK]

The uniform has years of being a TR hot potato.

[chen]

I at leasst put my real name on every post and do not hide behind a screen name furnishing no bonafides as to either knowledge or experience. Your post does not deserve any response. I am done with this thread.

[BrianK]

At least BC has stopped typing in all caps.

[11C]

I first saw this group of material at Steve Wolfe's thirty years ago and I can at least tell you all that nothing has been added or subtracted to what Steve showed me then. I continued to see these very pieces several times a year up until a few years ago and nothing was added or changed during those viewings as well. Whatever Steve originallly purchased back then has been passed on to CG without change. That is a fact!!! The group is unaltered and complete in all respects. Is it real? Why is it being sold now? Why is CG involved? Who knows................none of us it appears. I'm just sorry that it has been tainted with the Richard Steel relationship, but that is no less of a concern to me than it being "brokered" by CG. That had to be the dumbest move in its history IMO.

[codytrcollector]

Your "type of experience" didn't help you with the Emil Maurice grouping or the Hitler tunic you pretend is real..

Mr. Coleman, whom I consider a friend, is well educated in our shared subject. I'm sure what he has owned far exceeds your collection as well his knowledge and experiences. We all make mistake, we shouldn't be crucified for them.
-----Additionally, I can personally verify his passion for this hobby. He has provided and worked with me-when he had nothing to gain-to obtain items I wouldn't come into contact with without him, all because he recognizes my passion and connections to the history of the Third Reich, WWII and the Holocaust.

[Jo Rivett]

Logic really. Why would someone who has been scooping up rotten apples from underneath the tree - and selling them as "Farm Fresh String Beans" for the past 14 years suddenly decide to "go sober" and actually sell string beans as - string beans.
Leopard - spots - change... Na.. not going to happen.

[blitzkrieg gsd]

I first saw this group of material at Steve Wolfe's thirty years ago and I can at least tell you all that nothing has been added or subtracted to what Steve showed me then. I continued to see these very pieces several times a year up until a few years ago and nothing was added or changed during those viewings as well. Whatever Steve originallly purchased back then has been passed on to CG without change. That is a fact!!! The group is unaltered and complete in all respects. Is it real? Why is it being sold now? Why is CG involved? Who knows................none of us it appears. I'm just sorry that it has been tainted with the Richard Steel relationship, but that is no less of a concern to me than it being "brokered" by CG. That had to be the dumbest move in its history IMO.

Thank you for your info on the group. The point of this thread was to hear from guys like you who have seen the group in person. That's what I was hoping to hear not all this negativity. That being said the reputation of Mr Steel does taint this group in my eyes. I had no idea he was had the reputation he does until I started this thread. But that's the kind of info I was looking for. Can you tell me if the group was always for sale when Steve owned it for all those years? I'm just having a hard time believing this group never sold. Back thirty years ago I imagine the group would have been expensive still. But when you think of the prices TR items brought back then it would have to be a lot less then the millions being ask for it now. So why did it not sell? Why would one of are so called whales not buy the group and donate it to museum back in the day! In all honesty if this group is legit it should be in a museum where everyone could see it.

The main question I am asking here is what is scaring off all the buyers? Is it the connection to Mr Steel? His reputation of putting together fakes? Or could it be the idea that this is to good to be true? Whatever it is there is a reason this is not in a collection already. It should have sold at the SOS last time around without a dought. When it didn't it got me to thinking why that was the case.

[11C]

Thank you for your info on the group. The point of this thread was to hear from guys like you who have seen the group in person. That's what I was hoping to hear not all this negativity. That being said the reputation of Mr Steel does taint this group in my eyes. I had no idea he was had the reputation he does until I started this thread. But that's the kind of info I was looking for. Can you tell me if the group was always for sale when Steve owned it for all those years? I'm just having a hard time believing this group never sold. Back thirty years ago I imagine the group would have been expensive still. But when you think of the prices TR items brought back then it would have to be a lot less then the millions being ask for it now. So why did it not sell? Why would one of are so called whales not buy the group and donate it to museum back in the day! In all honesty if this group is legit it should be in a museum where everyone could see it.

The main question I am asking here is what is scaring off all the buyers? Is it the connection to Mr Steel? His reputation of putting together fakes? Or could it be the idea that this is to good to be true? Whatever it is there is a reason this is not in a collection already. It should have sold at the SOS last time around without a dought. When it didn't it got me to thinking why that was the case.

I personally do not think Steve was ever hawking the material. He had it on display but like all of Steve's items.............there is always a price, (a big one, but always a price). I just never heard a figure mentioned in 30 years. There are 20 or 30 items he has had on display for 20+ years and I would expect to see them there for another 20, but that's what I "assumed" with the Hitler items too. Honestly, I never though he would sell the group.............I never even asked though.

[blitzkrieg gsd]

So as far as you know he wasn't trying to push the group out the door then? That makes since I don't know Steve personally but I would guess he's also a collector himself. So maybe it was a favorite of his collection. We all have items that stand out to us and would be the last ones we would sell. That makes since to me so I wounded why he decided to let it go over the last few years? There had to be offers made to him over the years for the group. Just wasn't the offer he was looking for until CG came along. CG says he is only looking to make a "small profit" from the group. When I read that I thought to myself that means he got a deal on the group or he wouldn't have bought it. I imagine that Steve only sold the group because it was the first offer that he felt was fair to him.

Wish that all the comments to this came back positive and everyone said the group was 100% good. Honestly that's what I was hoping for when I started the thread and ask the questions. I figured there would be a couple nay Sayers but nothing like what I have found out. For a group of this stature I need 100% confidence in it to believe it. After all this is the leader of the TR we are talking about here.

[Glenn McInnes]

And who is the author of the quoted segment above so their credibility can be judged?

I have no horse in this race, but would only like to know where, on either side, the truth stops and the bullsh-t begins.

Sir,

I am just showing an example of some of the stuff out there that has been written about this set and possibly one of the reasons why it has not sold.

It looks genuine enough to me but I am not a Political collector and unlike mass factory produced items there are not many examples out there of these items that you can compare with...They are "one of a kind".

Did Bill Shea not own a Hitler brownshirt and visor?





Glenn