Hitler uniform

[blitzkrieg gsd]

Ok Bob thanks for taking the time to look into it and Merry Christmas to you and yours also.

[Ron Weinand]

No, this came out of Hitler's Munich apartment. Straight from his closet. the tunic is all I have had the pleasure of inspecting so many years ago. The BO is hand engraved 1 is large and has many lines engraved to form the number and is unique. Obviously not stamped numbered, so it had to be plain to start with IMO.

[Ron Weinand]

No disrespect to anyone posting here, but this is a great illustration of how some facts can be turned and mis-represented to condemn an item with no real facts being involved in the discussion. Here is a case where questions about originality were totally off base and damage could have been done to an otherwise unquestionable piece's reputation, let alone the owner.
In the case of Craig Gottlieb, just remember some times a blind hog finds an acorn while rooting in a pile of ------.

[Serge M.]

Thank you Wags that just what I'm looking for. That's the kind of info I was hoping to hear from a experienced collector. I knew that it just had to have something that wasn't rite with it. You know how sometimes you get that feeling something's not rite? Well that's how I was feeling when I saw it at the show. No one I talked to had or would share the info on this famous con man. His involment with the group and his known action of having fakes made in China is scary. That throws salt on the whole thing. How could you ever think about paying millions for a group with that in its history. I just don't think I would be sleeping at nite with thought on my mind. Guys passing up the group back in the day that tells me a lot to. Don't sound like those guys back then had any faith in it either.

Well no disrespect is meant to anyone, just thoughts of a opposite opinion. I don't know if the Gob's tunic is authentic or not. However, 'Biltzkrieg' you go by your 'gut' feelings and they are most likely better than any expert here.
Ask why; Kesserling's Field Marshall baton sold for over a $1M.
Goring's Reichsmarschall document for $1M
Sepp Dietrichs Damascus LAH Presentation sword for (rumored) $1M.

But Hitler's tunic, was passed by all the hobby whales. Why it must be the deal of the decade. Just wonder why the Wolf/Harden (dealers to the stars) couldn't sell it. And then Gob ends up with it.
Yep, my gut says somethings not right here.

Besides I knew the collector who lived in the Hollywood Hills, who bought the AH Silver grouping from Hollywood Military Hobbies, and Roger Steele sold it to him. I knew the collector, I saw the set, I knew Roger Steele. The silver set was near mint condition. That's why I believe the story. The fact that Roger Steele had the grouping as stated by the collectors letter is being somehow downplayed, because it taints 'good provenance'. and you know, we can't have that.

All we want is the truth. If HMH had the stolen grouping, or didn't they?
Who did the rebuild on the Visor ? and when ?

Don't mean to do any 'injustice' to any item. Just something is not quite right here for me. And it's got my Spidy Sense tingling.

btw, Merry Christmas !

-wagner-

[chen]

I believe the reason of why this Hitler's grouping remains at Wolfe's collection for so long is mainly due to he does not want to break up the grouping to sell.
The asking price is much much more than $1M. Not too many that kind of collectors. Most of the collectors are just medals or peaked cap or uniform..etc.
They do not want something not interested to them, eg, the drawing tools or the cup etc.
Beside, say if a peaked cap collector purchases the peaked cap, how would this affect remaining value the brown shirt. So a grouping like this is difficult to sell than a single field marshal baton or Hitler's suicide pistol.

[Ron Weinand]

I am sure Steve did not want to sell the tunic for years and maybe even now. The question then becomes, what is the reason it is sold. I am sure there was a reason that had nothing to do with originality, but we probably will never know, or may never want to know.

[Bob Coleman]

I am sure Steve did not want to sell the tunic for years and maybe even now. The question then becomes, what is the reason it is sold. I am sure there was a reason that had nothing to do with originality, but we probably will never know, or may never want to know.

It is really none of our business why Steve sold the group Roger Steele never owned or even handled the Hitler group. His name should not be included in the discussion of the Hitler group.

[BobI]

No, this came out of Hitler's Munich apartment. Straight from his closet. the tunic is all I have had the pleasure of inspecting so many years ago. The BO is hand engraved 1 is large and has many lines engraved to form the number and is unique. Obviously not stamped numbered, so it had to be plain to start with IMO.

Thanks Ron!
I have not though about this for 20 years, I knew a closet had something to do with the story.
Steve is not only one of the biggest dealers around he is also one of the biggest collectors too. Probably like many of us collector/dealers, items we like normally get a price hoping people don't buy them. I wish I was a simple dealer and not collector, life would be much better
Happy New Year!
Bob

[blitzkrieg gsd]

See there's so much misinformation here did Steele have the group or not? That's a big deal to me if a known con man had it. And I agree with Wags that it should have no reason for not selling. Other items have brought that kind of cash so that's not the problem. Really compared to items he listed to group would be a deal. But nobody is buying it that tells me there's no faith in it.

[Ron Weinand]

Really? What items sold for 7 large cause I must have missed them?

[Johnny R]

I would trust the summery of the case and filing more than other sources-

http://www.leagle.com/decision/19702...0MOHAWK%20ARMS

[Johnny R]

I would trust the summary of the case and filing more than other internet sources-

http://www.leagle.com/decision/19702...0MOHAWK%20ARMS

[historyhunter18]

I have not spoken with Ray about this in decades but if I remember correctly the hat, perhaps all of it, was found in a police station. I will ask Ray to verify this next time I see him. So, don't hold me to this until I verify it.
Merry Christmas!
Bob

Ray has also fobbed off a fake ''Kurt Franz'' uniform with one hell of a story on his auction for between $5k and $15k.

why would we believe a word that he come out with?

because hes a hobby whale??

[BrianK]

Ask Ray - if he is such an expert on authenticity - why he still has all those fakes in his auctions? As for Wolfe, all the Wrigley gum fortune money in the world doesn't prevent you from getting some fakes inadvertently.

[blitzkrieg gsd]

Why would CG or the WH guys ever put out the money for this group with all this tainted history? It makes me think both of them got such a bargin on the group they couldn't pass it up. So when I hear CG talk about making a small profit I'm laughing to myself. Does anyone know if Wolf Hardin have been trying to sell this group over the last couple years before CG bought it? It's strange to me this group hasn't been displayed at the last half dozen SOS. That would be the show to land a whale at after all.

I keep going back to the tought that this group has been hard to sell. Yes I understand the price tag is big but so is the item. Guess that what gives me the biggest red flag on the group. All the story's about the chain of custody don't help. But the fact that no one would buy the group for there collection tells me the most.