Pilot-Observer Badge with Diamonds today

[Leroy]

And what about the one in the back?

[Dietrich Maerz]

I have no knowledge of that cross. But for me at least it is clear that Pelz could have worn only one cross during the war and strictly based on the award date of 14. October 1940 the "800" Juncker is the most likely cross. And that is what I was told by the owner. Never heard of a second cross .....

[Leroy]

I have no knowledge of that cross. But for me at least it is clear that Pelz could have worn only one cross during the war and strictly based on the award date of 14. October 1940 the "800" Juncker is the most likely cross. And that is what I was told by the owner. Never heard of a second cross .....

You didn't see it when you scanned the O&S? Why could he have not had a second cross (NOT the "award" cross) to wear in combat?

[Dietrich Maerz]

Gentry,

he could have had 50 crosses if he wanted to, I guess. If you want that cross in the corner to be his awarded cross or a cross he bought whenever and wore during the whole war, there is nothing I can say. I don't know that cross, I don't know whether it is made of zinc, rubber, brass or iron. I never saw it not did I scan it. The owner came to me and brought a lot of things to scan (including Diamonds..), but not this cross. I would have scanned it and I would have reported it. I think you know that.

Dietrich

[Leroy]

...he could have had 50 crosses if he wanted to, I guess. If you want that cross in the corner to be his awarded cross he wore during the whole war, there is nothing I can say.
Dietrich

Dietrich - I do NOT want that cross to be his "awarded" cross at all (and the Juncker as the actual "award" piece is perfectly appropriate!), so don't make fun of me. It was over a year between the time Peltz got the RK in 1940 and the Oakleaves in 1941. He could easily have commercially acquired a second cross for wear in combat during that period.

P.S. If you had seen the other cross, I'm sure you would have scanned it (even if you thought it was postwar.).

[Dietrich Maerz]

I am not making fun of you! I am just reporting what I know and what I have heard and what I have seen and what I have scanned. You asked me why I did not scan that cross and that cross was just not among the things that were brought to me to scan. I don't know why he didn't bring it ....

I guess Pieter knows otherwise he would have not made that statement, or? You have to ask him. For all I know, I don't even know whether this cross is a S&L with a zinc core. Not to talk about "wartime" and "worn during the war". Evidently the Junkcer was also worn ...

Dietrich

[Leroy]

Dietrich (and Tom) - I did not look at this display and rely on Pieter (who, I understand from others - not him directly - is very familar with what Peltz had).

The trick now is to look for photos of Peltz (when he was just a lowly RK winner, before he was famous) to see what he might be wearing. (The same also for Werner Baumbach, who I understand to have also had such a "spare".)

[Dietrich Maerz]

Well, if he is so familiar with the Pelz group then he will know. He will also know, I guess, when Dietrich Pelz bought or got or received the "S&L with a zinc core". Since it is pretty clear that Pelz was awarded a Juncker and that that Juncker was worn by somebody - most likely Pelz. At least that is what the owner thought when he brought it to me for scanning.

Dietrich

[Leroy]

I would have no doubt that he wore the Juncker (but maybe another, too).

[Stan]

Sepp,

Great thread

Here are photos of a piece offered to me by DN several years ago.

This style differs to the Moelders (early) and Hartmann (late) pieces which is perhaps why people like Andreas Thies say there are three different types of these badges.

I must admit that I know very little about this style so perhaps the experts out there can tell us what they think of it.

Stan

[Pieter Verbruggen]

The Peltz group shown in the case is a part of his medals and docs. The group was sadly split up due to the cost of it at that time. The cross in the back corner is a zink core S&L with an attached card signed by Peltz himself as is the case for the swords. All his medals were the wartime received pieces.
....but.... let it rest...it's fake
Pieter.

[Pieter Verbruggen]

Gentry,

he could have had 50 crosses if he wanted to, I guess. If you want that cross in the corner to be his awarded cross or a cross he bought whenever and wore during the whole war, there is nothing I can say. I don't know that cross, I don't know whether it is made of zinc, rubber, brass or iron. I never saw it not did I scan it. The owner came to me and brought a lot of things to scan (including Diamonds..), but not this cross. I would have scanned it and I would have reported it. I think you know that.

Dietrich

...if it's made of rubber...it's called a "dildo".....
Pieter.

[Dietrich Maerz]

The Peltz group shown in the case is a part of his medals and docs. The group was sadly split up due to the cost of it at that time. The cross in the back corner is a zink core S&L with an attached card signed by Peltz himself as is the case for the swords. All his medals were the wartime received pieces.
....but.... let it rest...it's fake
Pieter.

Ok, you say it is a fake, then this closes this issue.

[Leroy]

The cross in the back corner is a zink core S&L with an attached card signed by Peltz himself as is the case for the swords. All his medals were the wartime received pieces.
....but.... let it rest...it's fake
Pieter.

I hope no one misses the subtlety.......

[Thomas Durante]

Hi guys,

I cleaned up this thread a bit to delete some of the "fluff" posts that have nothing to do with diamonds' badges. We don't want to derail Sepp's great reference thread.

Pieter, did each and every item in the case have a signed tag from Pelz, or was it just the S&L RK?

Tom