Where is the truth on TK rings?

[Antonio Scapini]

last.

[Antonio Scapini]

Is that the casting seam in picture number two? It looks like the same seam as the bad ones earlier in the thread. Also from the same dealer with Boyle COA?

Yes, with also emails full of stories.
I received some interesting emails in these days.

That sign is really odd at least and the engraving too (look at the "K" of the first ring for example or at the trembling engraving of the second). I would like to hear Don and Andy's opinions, and better pictures if possible.

Anyway as I always said, apart some clear signs (as we saw) of casting or bad engraving, each ring MUST be seen in hands. And I repeat that I suggest to all those interested to buy a microscope, because even without any knowledge on rings you can check the good from the bad simply looking at the metals and the construction.

[TheGoodWitch]

fair use
noun
noun: fair use; plural noun: fair uses

(in US copyright law) the doctrine that brief excerpts of copyright material may, under certain circumstances, be quoted verbatim for purposes such as criticism, news reporting, teaching, and research, without the need for permission from or payment to the copyright holder.


The use of the images certainly falls under the fair use clause.

[GiuseppeC]

That 'WARNING" seems really odd......you would think that they would WANT more potential customers to see such a fine specimen............

Brian:

The warnings appearing on the page(s), are new, and were not in place on the page(s) at the time this discussion started.

All they tell me, is that being caught red-handed must really be bothering Andy.

[sgstandard]

Ring

That's called "feigned indignation".
Boy, those last few rings posted sure are clunkers.
Do they have a COA also?

[Jeff V]

Is that 4 fake rings with Boyle COA? Have these all been sold by the same dealer? If so, have these rings been seen before their appearance with this dealer? It would be interesting to find the origin of these pieces.

[australia]

Where is the truth on TK rings?

I have my suspicions where these rings are coming from , hint - he wrote a book and states in the book that honor rings were cast ...

He owns 20 or 30 cast HR

[Fred Green]

Is that 4 fake rings with Boyle COA? Have these all been sold by the same dealer? If so, have these rings been seen before their appearance with this dealer? It would be interesting to find the origin of these pieces.

Hello,

This is probably the "tell" here. Same dealer bad rings.

Fred

[Gaspare]

Recieved a few emails to make a comment on this topic..
- great this got pinned.. Just my opinion,,I do not think other rings should be added. Things are confusing enough as there seems to be at least one more topic about the same ring [s].. A HR in question,,it should have its own topic even if its from same seller or has same problems with it..
-anyway,

I know Don a long time. Know Andy even longer. Andy is a collector/dealer and like all dealers they can't be a expert/specialize in everything. So, they sometimes depend on others for authentication. Andy brings all his HRs to Don to authenticate. For him,,if Don says its good and gives him a cert then its good so for me Andy is out of this.. IF you ever buy something from him and your not happy,,he's more than glad to refund and never have heard of a problem with him..

Don many years ago promised,,he would never certify a HR unless he held it in his own hands no matter how good the photos were... It's just a statement I'm repeating I've heard a few times...

The HR on page one of this topic. - I like HRs but I'm not an specialist on them. I'm a PP guy.. Anyway In my opinion the HR on the first page certainly is unorthodox. For me to the point that I'm not a fan of it..
I've personally been to many digs in Ukraine in the 90s. Seen many a private purchase rings of all types of materials come up from the ground,,,that HR is not from the ground/ or at the very least the damage, wear to it was not caused by being in the ground in my opinion...

Who ever bought it,,,if your not happy with it,,send it back..
- Don, your a good guy but by any means you nor anyone else on this planet is perfect. Everyone makes mistakes....



PS
Mr.Gottleib thinks the HR
could have been cast.. They are not.
They are die pressed in the
flat. A separate skull then
soldered on after size determination.

[I Claudius]

People tried to take Charlie Schneider to task from memory quite a few times but got nowhere. The feds simply don't have the expertise and the money involved sadly- while a lot to an individual- just doesn't justify the time I would think from their point of view for fraud of this nature - if that's what's it's proved to be.
It was maybe a year ago when I saw a disc which was ropey as hell but the buyer was happy as it came with dons cert and who could argue with that at the time. Sad to say it makes me think again as to whether my concerns were correct.

[Antonio Scapini]

Is that 4 fake rings with Boyle COA? Have these all been sold by the same dealer?

Yes, the emails were sent me with those rings, came all from the same dealer, with the stories of the rings and all them had COA.

Andy is a collector/dealer and like all dealers they can't be a expert/specialize in everything. So, they sometimes depend on others for authentication. Andy brings all his HRs to Don to authenticate. For him,,if Don says its good and gives him a cert then its good so for me Andy is out of this.. IF you ever buy something from him and your not happy,,he's more than glad to refund and never have heard of a problem with him..

Andy sells rings since more that 10/20 years, he handled many. That means he still know almost nothing about them.
If he is glad to refund, good to know. Will he refund the owner of the first ring that is a cast fake, even if Don said it was good, he stood in his position and it has the unquestionable COA?

One thing more I'm not sure of:

My reputation as well as Andy's is very well known in the hobby and we do not sell fakes.

That "we". But of course we can't know how the things go, they only know. They could clarify many things simply answering.

[Jeff V]

Very bad. Anyone can make a mistake, no problem. But how can fake after fake with coa be sold by the same dealer? Even worse, three of these fakes show what looks to be the same casting seam between skull and ring. How many people out there are holding one of these fakes with a COA? In response, instead of some normal discussion we have threats and Don posts a bunch of unrelated nonsense.

[sgstandard]

Rings

What I find perplexing, is why Mr. Boyle defended the ring that initially started the thread.
IMO, it made no sense.........
Had he agreed with all of us that the ring was a stinker in the first place, because of his esteemed reputation, the entire topic would have shifted to "fake COAS", no matter HOW many fake rings surfaced with his COA. Then, we'd be arguing whether someone faked his COA, or if they attached a real COA to a fake ring.
We'd be looking at watermarks...paper-quality......and it would be a virtual COA goose-chase......
But he defended the indefensible, IMO.......so here we are.
As for Andy, I understand he relies on Mr. Boyle to authenticate rings, but after handling and selling many TK-Rings himself, how could he look at the initial ring in the thread and the Bruns ring, and not see anything wrong with either of them?

[I Claudius]

That's got to be lamest nonsense I've seen in a long time on the legere ring page.
We can track your ip address if you copy this pic and tell on you for doing it.
Meh... guess we'll all just have to use screen shot instead then to avoid this dreaded fate
Truly the dealers version of I'll tell your friends you smell if you tell the teacher on me.

[Gaspare]

I know some think of it as fun,,but I don't anymore and don't want to spend an hr with a loop , then switch to the micrscope, then maybe even further testing... Think of what we see on these forums.. SS cap devices, embroidered pieces, helmets, daggers etc etc. Look at all the diff forums on this site,,,and each has its own specialists.. So totally possible for a dealer to see a HR,,like it,,and say 'if Don papers it I'll buy it'.. For me Andys fine... I know many that know 100% their HR is fine,,,but still want Dons paper so it will be easier to sell when its time
Don, unless he now believes they are cast there probably is a problem..

Look guys,,this happens all the time. The person becomes an 'expert'. writes a few books.. Then its found out they were either crooks or weren't the expert everyone thought they were,,or just get older and they're not up on things anymore.. SS helmet decals come to mind?, enamel party pins? fantasy high end badges,,camo, daggers!! IF this all rings true its up to the 'expert' to do the explaining!