My new DAK helmets

[anmarlodz]

As far as I remember; I heard from few sources that Czecholsovaks ( Not Czechs as in late 40thies and 50thies till 1993 there were not seperate Czech and Slovaks but Czechoslovaks ! ) were using German leaftover ( also finished but never used leaftovers from production ) till early 50thies when USSR take fully control over czechoslovak goverment and supplied them with their own soviet gear.
Also theory of egyptian connection I hread says that this contract supposed take place in 50thies but USSR forced Czechslovaks to cancell whole deal and sold own gear to Egyptian army.
Any way; when I first saw and had one of those tan painted helmet my first thought was that EVERYTHING (including paint) looks like it was period done - shade of paint was identical with paint you can find on most of german equipment ( very late war equipment).
One thing I can say for sure if all those tan painted helmets were ONLY M42 helmets than I would say that was very very late production which was using what they had in their faciliticies hence tan painted helmets . As I mentioned earlier I have already seen very late war gasmask canisters factory painted in tan ( so why not helmets ).
But since there are also M35 and M40 than SS facilities theory make a bit of sense.

[NickG]

Any way; when I first saw and had one of those tan painted helmet my first thought was that EVERYTHING (including paint) looks like it was period done - shade of paint was identical with paint you can find on most of german equipment ( very late war equipment).
As I mentioned earlier I have already seen very late war gasmask canisters factory painted in tan ( so why not helmets? ).
But since there are also M35 and M40 than SS facilities theory make a bit of sense.

Agreed and H & C apparently also liked these, as they used them for their (mostly SS) impressions. They figured it out a long time ago!

[NickG]

Also used for their late war Heer Sudfront (Mediterranean) impressions in the H&C books/magazines some 20+ years ago ,
when these surfaced...but mostly depicted as tropical SS!
Note the minty chinstraps! Depot queens for sure!!
(just like the SS uniforms btw)

[NickG]

I've always liked the look of SS Saharianas combined with late war ordnance tan painted helmets
The minty helmets were never trusted but the uniforms (from the same source) people had no problems with strangely enough...All mint all period German made with 100% correct German parts for the most part...(except for the used and fixed /recycled, Czech post war Civil used/messed with ones)!

[Jos L C]

It all reminds a bit of the white German helmets our fire fighters used in the 60's, all good German helmets but painted white post-war and some got a new life as Ostfront helmets, or the grey gasmask canisters, often sold as KM, but painted post-war for home defense troops etc..

I see no proof sofar ..

Jos.

[NickG]

It all reminds a bit of the white German helmets our fire fighters used in the 60's, all good German helmets but painted white post-war and some got a new life as Ostfront helmets, or the grey gasmask canisters, often sold as KM, but painted post-war for home defense troops etc..

I see no proof sofar ..

Jos.

Were gray gas mask canisters factory painted or camo painted in proper KM battleship RAL gray? Nope!
Slapped on (hand painted) post war for other (post war) use with whatever gray paint!
Same goes with white "camo"(Fire?) ...white helmets from the factory obvious don't exist, another apples to pears comparison!
Quality painted white helmets don't exist...it was field done, unit level done...unlike the helmets in this thread!

and none of those 2 quoted (post war use) examples would have 100% war time components either! (from the same region!!)

These are DunkelGelb RAL color professionally (factory) painted (period) helmets...A totaly different scenario! dis-similar!
Look again at the images of these (period) refurbished helmets...intended for Sudfront use with official Ordnance paint on them!
No comparison!
The proof is the professional finish, 100% German parts, location found, and period images of same! and the Egypt story got debunked!
What else is needed?

Maybe we should create a poll here and find out if this thread opened any eyes, changed any views on these intriguing helmets!
I am more convinced than not...and could use one for this impression in my collection!

[Jean-Loup]

"These are DunkelGelb RAL color professionally (factory) painted (period) helmets...A totaly different scenario! dis-similar!
Look again at the images of these (period) refurbished helmets...intended for Sudfront use with official Ordnance paint on them!"

I am not against the idea of these being late war unisued items, but this does not justify the use of flawed logic. In this case I do not understand why no full yellow helmets were produced in the 1940-43 DAK period, and all of a sudden when the war is winding down they decide to produce yellow helmets for a supposed Russian Südfront? Possible... yes. Obvious and logical... no.

JL

[NickG]

"These are DunkelGelb RAL color professionally (factory) painted (period) helmets...A totaly different scenario! dis-similar!
Look again at the images of these (period) refurbished helmets...intended for Sudfront use with official Ordnance paint on them!"

I am not against the idea of these being late war unisued items, but this does not justify the use of flawed logic. In this case I do not understand why no full yellow helmets were produced in the 1940-43 DAK period, and all of a sudden when the war is winding down they decide to produce yellow helmets for a supposed Russian Südfront? Possible... yes. Obvious and logical... no.

JL

Because J-L that is DAK = Heer....they made stuff up in the field.... their modus operandi... and they were rushed to Africa to help Mussolini....vehicles had to be repainted too...Different time frame, different branch different circumstances...
and this is Waffen-SS.
Again as pointed out in an earlier post , as we all know the W-SS was always into camoflage and would supply camo helmet covers for certain theatres , so why not factory pre-camo painted sand/olive colored helmets for mediterranean use?...It was their philosophy and they had the industry to do it...Procuring outside of the Heer channels, their own designs, access to a labor force....KZ and other...
Tan uniforms, tan pith helmets and tan steel helmets... = matching tropical kit, all specific SS designs and the paint was readily available too because it was a mid/late war German vehicle and ordnance (base) paint! Convenient and with Skoda etc...there was plenty of such paint! Big time Reich war industry in the Protectorate!
With Sud front we mean Greece + Italy (occupation duty) and Balkans (partisan war fare), not necessarily South Russia/Crimea, Ukraine,

See post #108..we even have a witness statement from an SS-veteran who recalled the following:
Also we have the account of the SS veteran who owned the photo album. He was issued with such a helmet while on tropical service in Greece. This helmet was issued to him in the CZ during WW2 and returned to the CZ during WW2 when he handed it back.

Btw SS smocks and helmet covers were also turned in after reassignment to an area where this gear was not required! = SS rule!
Where is the doubt on this stuff? For me these are facts...the other facts are that the Egyptian story is just that a story (or assumption)
because of some weapons being delivered there in the 50's which turned out to be USSR Soviet (via CZ)...
and another fact is that the Czech army did not order these for their own use post war, and Czech civil defence/fire services would not have ordered these (post war) in that kind of quantity AND 100% built to German specs with German paint (in Division size?) Why?
So who else could have been the customer for all these helmets from the Prague area you may wonder?
(where a lot of tropical gear, Saharianas. piths, etc... were made and found...All a big coincidence you think? Really?
That's to me clearly a military pre 1945 contract, for the W-SS, with German parts and paint! The geography proves it too!

Lets do a poll!
Who knows how to add one to this thread?

[90th Light]

"These are DunkelGelb RAL color professionally (factory) painted (period) helmets...A totaly different scenario! dis-similar!
Look again at the images of these (period) refurbished helmets...intended for Sudfront use with official Ordnance paint on them!"

I am not against the idea of these being late war unisued items, but this does not justify the use of flawed logic. In this case I do not understand why no full yellow helmets were produced in the 1940-43 DAK period, and all of a sudden when the war is winding down they decide to produce yellow helmets for a supposed Russian Südfront? Possible... yes. Obvious and logical... no.

JL

The germans never planned to fight a war in North Africa and had to adapt their tropical uniform at very short notice. They never had the time to make all that they needed.

The SS & KM were the last to develope a tropical uniform by 1942 and had the more time plus the benefit of what the WH had experienced, learnt the hard way or were requesting as a short-fall. Plus the SS had their own refurbisment factories,

Chris

[msteve21]

Egyptian German Helmets

Just out of interest, Egyptian Republican Guards wearing a mixture of helmets, some appear to be West German police helmets? possibly the M40 / 53 or the M54 Border Guards type helmet?

Reference; http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/world-...tary-333923-2/

It be fair to say whoever put these helmets together must have sourced the shells directly from the manufacturer ( then painted them) or had them painted before being shipped out, otherwise how do you explain them having only one coat of paint. No one would have gone to the trouble of stripping back wartime paint and repainting, either during the war or after.

Mark S

[NickG]

Interesting image however different (olive) paint, different liners, note double pins in the back and different chin straps. Probably BGS, Bundesgrenzschutz surplus... They also wore East German helmets if you look at that thread...all from the 1960's or 1970's. The fact that it is a color photo also dates the image to that time frame.
It does prove that surplus gear went to North Africa ...which was the norm for developing countries...Surplus from a later period....not a Prague depot Ww2 connection to me...No doubt surplus "firefighter style" German helmets were imported and issued for riot control needs...

Obviously not RBNr coded intact war specification helmets, the topic of this thread, but nevertheless an interesting mix of gear, the norm for 3rd world countries...and does prove that they used some sort of German originating helmet which went over there...or rebuilt post war Czech civil service? Or are these DAK campaign left over rebuilt shells ? I doubt that...but yes replacement internals if M 36/m40...
unlike the mint helmets with RBNr parts...which makes me conclude ww2 unissued production....
and you can't ignore the vet witness statement that these were issued in (dark) tan color in Prague along with saharianas......
anyway an interesting photo nevertheless.

[trevor87bikes]

After all the opinion given by solid collectors here on this forum you don't want to ear the true so keep them in you collection,be happy with for the 20 years coming but they will stay bad... how funny is the way you are collecting military things ...

Even though solid collectors say they are post war surely that's not proof ..if they was ss tropical helmets or late war produced for a certain theatre and unfortunately there was no evidence to prove it then the so called solid collectors would not know 100% wether they was or wasn't

Matt

[trevor87bikes]

Also if so many of these were seen in the 80s appearing in the usa at every gun and military show how did they all get to the US and not as many in Europe

[NickG]

Also if so many of these were seen in the 80s appearing in the usa at every gun and military show how did they all get to the US and not as many in Europe

They hit these shores after the wall came down...but in such big quantities that people distrusted them (again, just like the minty Ukranian G43 pouches from USSR mothballed inventories...) exact same scenario...no doubters on those anymore...

[jerryrehr]

If you believe these are WW2...please tell me your thoughts on the Easter Bunny, Santa and the Tooth Fairy.
Jerry