I will email Jak Showell who wrote "The German Navy in WWII" and ask him if he has any information on this badge.
John
John
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Last edited by John R.; 11-04-2009, 10:48 PM. -
Jak's reply
Jak Showell's reply to my email:
"Dear John,
Thanks for your email and for the photos.
What you have written seems to be correct, but please bear in mind that this a subject I know very little about.
The German name of the Badge is "Abzeichen des Wachhabenden Offiziers" and regulations about this position are almost endless.
The badge would have allowed him to dispense with the wearing of a sword when formal dress was ordered.
In port he would usually also have worn a pistol.
If having to wear a dagger, he could have secured it more tightly than the usual hanging belts - the idea being that he might have to move rather quickly.
It is quite likely that there would also have been a Wachhabender Maat - who would also have worn a pistol in port and perhaps (I don't know exactly) at sea.
There is a bit about this in J. Zienert "Unsere Marineuniform" published by Helmut Gerhard Schulz Verlag in Hamburg in about 1970. Probably long out of print.
Sorry I cannot provide more detailed information.
With best wishes.
Jak"Comment
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I think we are getting our terms mixed up so I will define them a little.
In the US Navy there is an 'Officer of The Deck' both at sea and alongside who is the Captain's direct representative.
In the KM ans most other Navies there is a distinction
Officer of the Watch -At sea (responsible for the safety of the ship)
Officer of the Day - Alongside (responsible for the security of the ship)
XO (Executive Officer)- Captain's direct representative
I days of old in the RN, USN, KM as Showell said one wore a sam brown with sword and piston I imagine gaiters and lanyard and medals as well if you wanted to get really fancy.
This would be impractical in wartime so the badge is a good alternative.
I do not think the OOD in the KM would have the Authority to take the ship to sea the XO(Executive Officer) would and either he or the Captain would be on the ship at all times during wartime. In the KM an OOD could be any officer who has his 'Harbour Watchkeeping Ticket' so he could in theory have 'no sea keeping experience at all' The OOD in the KM could be an engineering officer/ Medical officer or even a catering officer not necessarily bridge watchkeeper.
When Jak writes
"The German name of the Badge is "Abzeichen des Wachhabenden Offiziers" and regulations about this position are almost endless."
I think the "Capitan's prerogative" comes into play even more.
cheersLast edited by byterock; 05-31-2007, 06:39 AM.Comment
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OvD
Offizier vom Dienste or Watch Officer Badge. The Bundesmarine still uses the badge so........ How does one tell if it is from the third reich era?
I've seen them with the Assmann marking on the back and also the OLC mark on the new ones. It also comes in two configurations for attachment purposes. The one I have is made of "kriegsmetal" so I'm pretty sure it is period. I also paid very little for it many moons ago, so I'm please with what I have.Comment
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Thank you very much. I myself had never seen this badge untill I bought the mentioned book. A nice addition to my collection. Thanks again gentlemen.
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Watch Officer Service Badge question
Hi all,
Hard to find much about the Dienst Abzeichen for Wachoffizier, the watch officer's service badge. I'm interested in the following one, maker marked Assman, billed as an original, but note that the source seems to have a few repros thrown in with original stuff on other sales. Does anyone know if these have ever been reproduced?
Cheers.
---NormComment
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Reverse
ReverseComment
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These badges was also produced and used after the war so you can find both war made and post war badges from this maker.
How to tell which is produced during the war and which is produced after is not easy since they are identical.Comment
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If I am not mistaken the Assmann marked examples are post war. I know John Robinson has studied these in detail and will be able to tell you for sure. At any rate, I don't like the look of the one you posted. Tom(PODO01) had a beautiful original on e-stand last time I looked, not sure if it sold yet. Comparing that one to what you just posted you will see a difference of night and day.
best wishes,
jeffLooking for a 30 '06 Chauchat magazine.Comment
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Thanks for the tip. I just went to the e-stand and bought Tom's! Main difference seems to be in the bar pin on the back.
Cheers.
---NormComment
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Watch officer
Hello all,
just wanted to put this up for opinion. I had this one for a while and wanted to give reassurance to norm who purchased it from me. If further pics are needed will have to wait until they arrive at destination. By the way the pin is attached to the top portion of the wreath. Thanks in advance.
TomComment
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2Comment
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Tom,
The watch officer badge was used postwar and is still in use today to the best of my knowledge. The easy badge of this type to determine whether or not period or postwar is made by Assman. No reason to get into this now since yours is not an Assman.
We do not know who made all the watch officer badges during the TR period and there were variations.
Certainly the badge was widespread in use, many thousands must have been produced and probably worn after the war in the Bundesmarine since no political insignia is on the badge.
Based on further comparisons with known originals, the finish of this badge and wear, I believe this is most probably a period badge. It is the Assman badge that appears post war but as I said, this is not an Assman post war badge.
Also the postwar badges do not have quite this nice of a finish.
JohnLast edited by John R.; 11-04-2009, 10:53 PM.Comment
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The next two are also accepted badges.
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