Unusual 1941 FJ helmet cover

[Jean-Loup]

Just a few months ago I was visiting an old man in southern France, in an area liberated by paratroops. When he told me he had kept a helmet from one of the americans, I started feeling the adrenaline. I asked him if I could see it. He brought me to his garage, where I found a french helmet from the 1950's (copy of US helmets). I told him it was a french helmet, and he said it was impossible.
I showed him the date in the helmet, about 1950. He still said it was american from 1944.
Then he said: "I remember, my helmet had a dent in the liner that I fixed". He looked for the dent and did not find it.

Then he said: "I am an old imbecile. I lent my helmet to a man a few years ago for him to wear it at the 50th anniversary of the liberation parade, and he gave me back this french helmet instead."

JL

[John Hodgin]

Then he said: "I am an old imbecile. I lent my helmet to a man a few years ago for him to wear it at the 50th anniversary of the liberation parade, and he gave me back this french helmet instead."

JL

Thanks Jean-Loup. It is so sad that creeps like this take advantage of people, especially older people.

[BrunoH]

Thanks Jean-Loup for the story.
Even if it was hard for me not to laugh, I think that the 'old man' you meet was 100 % sure to have an original helmet... and would swear it !!
That's what we can learn...
Let's be always paranoiac !!!

[Jean-Loup]

"It is so sad that creeps like this take advantage of people, especially older people"

Especialy when this creep supposedly honnors veterans by participating in a parade.


"Even if it was hard for me not to laugh, I think that the 'old man' you meet was 100 % sure to have an original helmet... and would swear it !! "

Yes, he was 100% sure, but also very smart and with a good memory, so logic prevailed after a minute or two of shock.
The same man had several other WW2 items, all 100% original and found localy.

JL

[Hptm. Fuhrmann]

I'm sorry to drag up this old thread, but I recently got Vol. 2 of Karl Veltzés 'German Paratroopers' and on page 100-101 there is a cover depicted that is described as 2nd pattern tropical helmet cover and it is made from the same double side printed thick canvas fabric and features the same makers stamps as the one that started this thread.

The consensus about OP's cover here was that is was an old fake, now I think this topic might should be revisited.

A quick google search revealed that it looks like there was a 'Erich Grahl AG" in Berlin at that time, and someone described as 'Erich Grahl, Textilkaufmann (textile trader), Berlin" was awarded the Federal Cross of Merit in 1967, so it looks like this maker isn't completely made up.

The 2nd pattern cover in the book is even accompanied by a picture of Fallschirmschütze 'G. Sch' that appears to be wearing just that kind of cover. Now if that one is genuine, couldn't that maker also have made 1st pattern covers, like the 2 examples we can see in this thread here?

[Willi Z.]

I think you will find that if the topic is revisited, there will be a difference in opinions.

[SMP]

Very interesting. So who now believes this type to be genuine ?

[kammo man]

The base fabric isn't even correct.
Case closed.

[SMP]

Must say I am disappointed with the lack of comments on this forum.

On the one hand we have a well respected reference book stating these covers are rare variants, while at the same time we have well respected collectors claiming they are blatant fakes.

[wehl]

interesting disscusion if published in a book must be real...just this book is realy good ,so im courios myself abaut this model of cover .

[Hptm. Fuhrmann]

The base fabric isn't even correct.
Case closed.

Compared to indisputably original 1st pattern covers it isn't, yes, but what makes it a fake now instead of a yet unknown variant?

The brown 4-row cotton twill tape around the cover is identical to the ones on genuine covers, I haven't seen that on any fakes yet.

The strangest thing is: No matter who made those covers, be it 'Erich Grahl AG' in the 40s or some faker in the 80s - why did they go through the trouble to screen print both sides of a sailcloth fabric with a Zeltbahn-like variation of the Luftwaffe spinter pattern when the covers that are made from it are non reversible?

It doesn't make much sense either way. If the faker had enough knowledge about original covers to use the right twill tape, and he had the means to screen print the correct camo pattern, why did he fudge it up with the 'wrong' base fabric?

And if they are original, why waste time and effort to print both sides? The exception may be that the fabric was intended for some experimental stuff with the newly introduced LW splinter pattern, but then they said "scratch it, we need helmet covers for out boys on Kreta now", so they just used what they already had. But that's just far fetched theorising now.

[kammo man]

You are going down a rabbit hole and over thinking it completely.

The actual camouflage base fabric is NOT German WW2 manufactured regardless of the other components.

Pretty simple.

[clint-magnum]

You are going down a rabbit hole and over thinking it completely.

The actual camouflage base fabric is NOT German WW2 manufactured regardless of the other components.

Pretty simple.

RIGHT

[Hptm. Fuhrmann]

You are going down a rabbit hole and over thinking it completely.

The actual camouflage base fabric is NOT German WW2 manufactured regardless of the other components.

Pretty simple.

I'm not sure how to understand this statement. Do you mean to say that the germans never printed camo on canvas fabric or that the base fabric itself (with or without camo) in not WW2 german issue?

I'm not going anywhere, I'm just trying to make some points and back them up as good as I can. I have no horse in the race on this one, I got nothing to lose and nothing to gain except knowledge.

[kammo man]

Heres what to do.
Buy yourself a splinter Zelt and start learning about cloth the old fashioned way.
Have fun.