Any Ideas on This Cross w/Swords (opinions appreciated) *

[Legion Condor]

I hope you enjoy looking and hope to have given something to discuss.

If my 1st series original is not original, the model of S & L is then the original? If this does not, there has never been an original Steinhauer and Lück Spanish Cross.
And this company has built crosses Spain in the period to 1945, shows the catalog of Steinhauer and Lück.
And the fact that is always to find this model in good documents is also undeniable.

The 4 can be explained on the crosses not by paper or logical research does not make them wrong. How I see it, who knows the reason exactly. My explanation is as I wrote in point 1. (Delivery Collective)

And the other pieces take even the place of the post-war pieces, so with no remains No. 1 there also space. I do not think the S & L has built shortly after the war so many different models.

As Dietrich always says: From the collector for collectors!

Greeting Hans Günter
Full forget this expertise is of DN to 2.Serie copy

[Leroy]

Very good work and a benefit to all collectors! Great to see confirmed in your findings many of the things we were "guessing at" before: original stock left, original parts left, new parts stamped but defects showing up, finishing not matching wartime, hardware mixed up, new hardware showing up, material quality wrong,etc., etc.

Do you think S&L still has the tools or are they gone now?

The "L/16" mark in the next-to-last cross which is "not the same" as in the first cross....Let me please make a suggestion (based on work by another person elsewhere): Here is the "L/16" supposedly used by a well-known German dealer on a false Panzer badge. It is said that it has also been used on many other false badges. Whether it is a real stamp from S&L I don't know, but this dealer, called "the Hero", uses it on others. When you compare this mark to the mark on the needle you show, it is the SAME.

[Legion Condor]

The tools are still there, but in such poor condition that the quality is not good anymore to sell.

The stamp L/16 my opinion, is the same, there are many manufacturers of copies.
By what right they come I do not know. I can only find the family and the collectors say what I think, nothing more.

Check the stamp on both the L connected to the dash below and 6 above also identically. Wherein the original L and the horizontal line is not composed, and 6 fine as in the two.

But I have to say that I am anti-tank badges and other not well versed and have no idea. Only the armor insignia of the Legion Condor I know very well.

Here's her and my copy stamp.

Greeting Hans Günter

[Leroy]

Based on just the "L/16" stamp, I would guess that "the Hero" may be responsible for the S&L SK copy (and perhaps even the "CEJ" SK copy from another thread?). The "eyes" of those with experience with his products would be helpful here.

[Thomas Durante]

Great and interesting thread, thanks for sharing

One question, when do you think the "adler head error" came about?

Thanks

Tom

[Legion Condor]

Great and interesting thread, thanks for sharing

One question, when do you think the "adler head error" came about?

Thanks

Tom

Hi,

yes is very Interssant with S & L. have long fought with me if I should make it public. but too much people were harmed, so I did not want to mention.

So exactly the same can not say it looks like a defective from the can fairly quickly. He has changed slightly over the course of time. Maybe it's gotten in the war. or where the tools of the S & L are gone. I have not seen the second series without the error. If you were to find a piece from the series without the error, then I think so to 1946., But it remains only a opinion of me and not evidence.

I am glad that it is interesting for you!

Her book on the parachute badge and I also take it very often to bed to read.

Greeting Hans Günter

[Leroy]

Hans Günter - A couple of times you have used words which seem to indicate that, for some period of time, S&L did not have the tools ("... the tools after the war by a ehmaligen owner of the company was taken away from the factory...", and "...(m)aybe it's gotten in the war or where the tools of the S & L are gone...").

Do you think someone else had the tools for some period of time?

Thanks!

[Legion Condor]

Hi Leroy,

There were times in Germany the rumors that an old boss of the company has retained the Wekzeuge and even worked for a time allowing. Whether he himself or on behalf of the white is not as accurate. I was just told that it has taken the old tools from handing over of the company by an owner issue. And almost all original algae from the period to 1945. Whether he has sold it, who knows.

What we 100% know is that they have been used for a long time after the war.
I think the evidence I have shown.

Greeting Hans Günter

[Leroy]

This is extremely interesting!

Certainly, the tools were used for a long time after the war.....But could the person who took them away have let someone else use them (or maybe he used them himself) in a different location? Is it possible that someone like Souval was allowed to use them for a time?

\

[Legion Condor]

hm,

since one can only speculate. I think the owner has yet produced significant for the occupation forces. And then resold. The original owner should no longer live. I do not think that are still in the possession families. The has determined someone professional lives of copies. But I really do not know defense.

Greeting Hans Günter

[Dietrich Maerz]

HansGünter,

bitte verkleinere deine Bilder bevor Du sie hier verlinkst. Am besten ist 72 dpi / 800-1000 pixel hoch und max. 600 breit.

Danke,

Dietrich

[Leroy]

The possibility of the tools being away from S&L for any period of time is the most fascinating thing I've heard in a very, very long time.

[Dietrich Maerz]

And almost all original algae from the period to 1945. Whether he has sold it, who knows.

Hans Günter,

could you please explain what that means?

Dietrich

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Hans,

Thanks for your reply and also your kind words about my Paratrooper badge book, very much appreciated.

I realize that this is only your opinion, but with all you know and have seen I would love to know what your thoughts are on S&L production in the immediate postwar period (June 1945 to 1950)? Do you think that S&L actually produced in this time period? Or do you feel anything from this time period was punched out in wartime but put together after the war for souvenier or returning vets, etc.?

Thanks

Tom

[Leroy]

....I think good at recognizing the piece down to the needle all the original parts were taken from the first piece. Only the quality was not as good. There were yet old residual stock in my opinion.

Tom - How could you tell when something started if you don't have pieces in front of you and know not only when they were bought, but also when they were completed??? This is the problem I've had for years. I don't think we will ever know with certainly about those first years, but instead can only speculate, as Hans Günter has said.