Whats the best site for South Vietnamese and Cambodian army stuff

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

Here is a rather hard to find hand sewn cotton flash in gold.

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

Silver bullion beret flash for em's. IMO this is one of the more difficult flashes to find. Bullion is a bit tarnished to a a gold color but it is silver.

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

Reverse details.

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

Here is another variation beret which is often encountered. It is made of a corded type material which is more lightweight than the wool ones. This one is also an officers with a foil label.

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

closeup of flash.

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

Label.

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

Here is an interesting pic provided to me by Bill Brooks.

[hochiminhtrail]

thanks for sharing Jeff, so we are basicaly divided into 2 groups the Infantry believers and the cao dai believers,
i still would like to know if the Cao dai under french rule used a beret insignia, i know that they were incorporated into the south vietnamese armed foces when they switched alliance to the French ( can t remember the exact date).

I think maybe we must go back to the french involvment to find the answer to this insignia. Does someone have a beret insignia of the vietnamese army in the 50s under french control? or did they use french insignias?

Cheers

Alex

[nguoi tien su]

Jeff, until at least 1956, this is the Cao Dai metal badge. It was first made in France by Drago. Two different local made versions exist, as well as an embroyed one.



At the center the Buddha fan is meant to settle down the problems so that Men can work on being better,
The fly-swat of Lao Tseu is to get rid off the dust that stick to human beings,
The sword that belongs to Confusius is the one of will, purity and wisedom,
The wheel with 9 flames is the one of evolution and metempsychose 9nice word...) one main idea of this religion.

The french had a special detachment working with the CaoDaists, named Mission de Liaison Francaise aupres de l'Etat Major des Forces Armees Cao Daistes.

In a book only dealing with vietnamese insignas, Symboles et Traditions numero special Vietnam, they also show our so controversial badge and they say : Sous toute reserve, cet insigne serait celui de beret des forces armees cao daistes, sans precision d'unite.
Which means : Without any confirmations, this badge could be the one for the berte of the Cao Dai Army, without any specific unit mentionned.

I know that a french professor has been doing his Phd on the Cao Dai sect. I will ask him if he also worked on the military aspect. I do think so as it was very important due to the influence of the sect.

I hope it helps.

NTS

[nguoi tien su]

Alex, our posts arrived together. Just on precision about the one I saw, it is a badge worn on the pocket, french style.

Cheers.

NTS

[nguoi tien su]

Jeff does Bill told you or do you know waht could be the breast badge on your photo??

[hochiminhtrail]

the Cao Dai took part in exuctions of French civilians in 1945 when japanses troops gave them arms and amunitions, in retaliation French troops under Leclerc raided their church in Thai Ninh, later the church served as a garage for the French armor vehicles.

Later they switched side with the Hoa Hao and the Bin Xuyen, the Bin Xuyen was a crime organisation whose Boss later became chief of the Saigon Police, they contreled the hookers, the casinos and other illegal money making institutions, until Diem came to power, (where else can a crime organisation become the police, only in SNAFU Vietnam of course)

in a book from Lucien bodard " l enlisement"

he notes that when he passed a convoy the cao dai flag was a cogwheel in the corner on a yellow background " un drapeau jaune marque au coin par une roue dante"

and now a very Intersting note

first he mention that some soldiers wore rag tag uniforms, from black to pink.

And know it comes" Ces combattants arborent tous sur leur beret l insignie de la religion. au milieu du cercle de la vie , l epee de la foi se croise avec le flambeau de la purete"

traduction:

These combatants are all wearing the insignia of the religion on their berets, in the middle of the circle of life the sword of the faith is crossing the flame of purity.

so i think it s the insignia NTS did show, we know now that they had their own beret insignias back then in the 50s.

by the way they served with the french from 1948 on until the end.

hope we are coming closer.

[Jeff Ashenfelter]

Very interesting indeed. The more you research the more you find out how varied the cao daiist history becomes. I would like to learn more so keep posting.
Today is a sad day. I saw these ebay postings and thought I would pass these along. I always look at repro berets to see what is new. This is the first time I have seen this variation hung dao label. Vietnam War Green Beret ARVN Special Forces AIRBORNE - eBay (item 370056382129
ARVN ranger "BDQ" beret - eBay (item 160245576825 end time Jun-03-08 03:04:12 if you look closely at the bottom of the paper label you will see the letters D.T., this translates to DIEN-THOAI which means telephone number. For years this was one of the best ways to id a good one from a bad one as the fakes omitted this number. It seems that this is no longer the case. Fortunately there are a few other ways to ID a good one. Jeff

[hochiminhtrail]

Hi jeff

the books from Lucien Bodard are the best books on the french war in Indochina, he made 3 volumes, a must for all collectors, i m not sure if they were translated into english?

There is an interwiew of the Coa Dai pope and how he visited their troops, very good description of the Bin Xuyen gang who became saigon police force, and the Hoa hoa sect.

unfortunatly i cant translate all the book, but he says that the Cao Dai made the worst bloodbath against the french in 1945, they were absolut fanatics.
when the Coa Dai and the Hoa hao joined the french the viet minh lost almost all its power in the Delta region, it was the best pacification program of all the war.

the Binh Xuyen gang were in the southern marsh land of Saigon ( Nha Be area they joined the french when the viet minh wanted to kill the Bin Xuyen boss to take over his organisation)

Cheers

Alex

[hochiminhtrail]

thanks Jeff for posting the Repros

Alex