Skulls and Freikorps!

[Sergeant 08]

...congrats Sergeant 08, and an interesting thread.

Thanks!

Hope to see more interesting skulls here.

[Brian L.]

Hi Stefan

I picked up this pair of Brunswick style skulls a while ago, as a representation of Freikorps Erlangen. Although, given the long use and history of these, one can never know for sure when they were used.

They have the big eye and small eye and the central line in the nostrils and are a frosted silver over brass, as one would expect. The teeth are actually sharply detailed, but flashed out on my scanner.

Opinion?

Brian

[Sergeant 08]

They have not the typical big eyes like Imperial skulls and they have not the smaller eyes, which you can find on many Wehrmacht used skulls. Hard to say, when this skull pattern was introduced. I have a cap from veterans with a similar skull.

[Brian L.]

I actually don't think they match exactly the skulls for Freikorps Erlangen, but could just be a variation.
Perhaps then they're the type used during the 1920s by various paramilitary organizations.

[Sergeant 08]

I guess a short time after ww1, the FK Erlangen still used the typical Imperial "big eyes" Brunswick skulls for example. The other skull pattern could be introduced later in the Weimar period.

[Brian L.]

To add to the confusion I've done a comparison between von Salomon, Bichlmaier/Hartung and Haarcke for FK Erlangen.

As you can see they're all different. von Salomon and Haarcke are the closest to my skulls.
But, for example von Salomon shows the nostrils as solid with a central ridge rather than the usual cut-out with a central line piece. But, he shows a big left eye and a smaller right eye like mine. I saw this type for sale once on eBay. But, I figured it wasn't real because the nose wasn't cut-out.

The Bichlmaier/Hartung version is different with rounded eyes. I generally don't like it, at least as a FK Erlangen skull.

Finally, I added one from Andre Huesken, which is the same as mine. While I know he's not always a reliable source, it does look believable.

So, I'm no closer to knowing which one is Erlangen. Although, I tend to favor von Salomon for obvious reasons. He's the only contemporary source.

Based on this, mine could indeed be FK Erlangen, given how close they are to the one in von Salomon and Heusken.

What do you think?

[Sergeant 08]

Salomon + Hartung: Typical Imperial skulls! I think such skulls were used by FK Erlangen.
Huesken and your skull: Later used in the Weimar period.
Haarcke: A typical skull pattern used on Wehrmacht headgear.

[Brian L.]

Salomon + Hartung: Typical Imperial skulls! I think such skulls were used by FK Erlangen.
Huesken and your skull: Later used in the Weimar period.
Haarcke: A typical skull pattern used on Wehrmacht headgear.

Well, you're the skull guy. So, I'll bow to your opinion.

Good. I can sell them then and buy something else.

[juoneen]

Not sure about this one...

I found this skull back in the early 80s on a hat non related, but never could find anything out about it...even for its possible originality or not, so here it is anyway...you guys tell me...because I just don't know, but added it anyway...and have some others I may add later.




Another shot the same in lower light..

[Sergeant 08]

The material is aluminium?

[juoneen]

Not sure, but a magnet doesn't stick, are there other metals that are not magnetic? Here is the other skull I wanted to re-post (missing the prongs) but an original for sure on this one...





This photo below is the correct color...the other light was used to accentuate the details.

[juoneen]

In my post for page 174 I found what appears to be a very close version in the old Assman catalog...here is the page, and then a closeup .








Since I have no provenance for that particular one ,....comments are in order, only it is too bad the catalog's never show the reverse side of any items for sale they manufactured.

[Brian L.]

Freikorps stickpin?

Sold on eBay for 67 Euros.

I believe this is the civil badge of Freikorps Schwarze Jäger, which was actually made up of former Marine Infantry, not Jäger troops.

[Sergeant 08]

This skull pattern is sometimes as single stickpin in auctions. In most cases offered as civil pin Wehrmacht Panzer from the 30's/40's.

If this skull was black painted, I think you could be right. Civil stickpin for Freikorps veterans. Or is it only black patina? Then there would be other possibilities.

For example Wehrmacht IR17. The regiment was in tradition of Imperial Jäger and Infanterie (IR92 who used a skull). Skull looks like a Prussian skull no Braunschweig. That is not really a problem. The IR17 first used the Braunschweig skull and the Prussian skull later.

[Brian L.]

I think the skull is painted black and the paint is wearing off.

I believe it is Freikorps Schwarze Jäger because they used a blackened Leibhusaren Danzig skull over a silvered deer skull and a blackened skull as a hat badge.

Here's the armbadge.