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    #166
    Originally posted by Uncle Kurt View Post
    Hallo,
    Sorry, The field flask sind no West German Army!

    feldgrau ist BGS

    and in Blau grau Bereitschafts Polizei and THW

    BW hat NUR 1956 a kokonat Bottel
    für eine ganz kurze Zeit.
    Eine Feldflasche mit oliv oder feldrau Flasche ist BGS? Interessant - ich habe das nicht gewusst. So viele Informationen über die frühe BW ist unbekannt zu mir und ich lerne noch.

    Aber es gibt ein Foto von der BW mit Feldflasche (1955 oder 1956). Gucken Sie Post #17 an:
    http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...=263442&page=2

    regards
    Klaus

    Comment

      #167
      Hallo,
      This Info kommt from a gut Freund from my:

      Soooo, here we go:


      Bundeswehr-Canteens 1955-1985


      1st Model: like Afrika-Canteen from WWII (dubbed "Kokosnuss"), slightly larger, webbing straps (one horizontal, one vertical),
      webbing-strap with snap-fastener on backside, Cup in BW-Olive drab colour, slightly larger at the opening, with
      US-Style folding Handle over top. Flask and Cup stamped "HRE 55" (Yes, same Manufacturer like Wehrmacht).

      Transition Model: like 1st Model, but with Leather Straps and Composite Material over the Hull, known Examples stamped from
      1956-1961.

      2nd Model: totally different, Aluminium US-Style body, big screwing cap, big cup with 2 big folding handles in wich the Flask
      was stowed, one vertical webbing strap with small strap round the top of the flask under the cap, used only for short
      time in the early 60ies.

      3rd Model: three-piece Canteen (flask, upper and lower halfes of Hull), which would be used as cups, one vertical webbing strap.

      Comment

        #168
        Onkel Kurt - sind hier die feldflaschen, die Sie beschreiben.

        Uncle Kurt - Here are the field flasks you describe.

        Danke - TJ
        Attached Files

        Comment

          #169
          Onkel Kurt - Ich glaube noch den Bundesheer benutzten fledflashcen M1931. Die Schalen in diesem Foto haben flache Oberseiten, die "Kokosnüsse" nicht. (BWGrenadierbatallion 22 - 1956).

          Uncle Kurt - I still believe federal soldiers (Bundeswehr) used the M1931 field flask. The tops of the field flasks in this picture are flat, the coconut canteens are not.

          Danke - TJ
          Attached Files
          Last edited by Thomas J. Cullinane Jr.; 02-03-2008, 01:15 PM. Reason: typo

          Comment

            #170
            Onkel Kurt - die Bundesheer Soldaten, die hier gesehen werden, benutzen Patronentaschen M1909. Warum fangen nicht M1931 Flaschen auf?

            Selbstverständlich könnte es sein, daß sie geborgte BGS Ausrüstung benutzen. Es gibt BGS Jäger in dieser Abbildung.

            Das würde uns beide korrekt bilden!

            Uncle Kurt - The Bundesheer soldiers seen here are using M1909 ammunition pouches. Why not M1931 field flasks?

            Of course, it could be that they are using borrowed BGS equipment. There are BGS troopers in this picture.

            That would make us both correct!

            Danke - TJ
            Attached Files
            Last edited by Thomas J. Cullinane Jr.; 02-03-2008, 01:16 PM. Reason: typo

            Comment

              #171
              Welcher Art Flasche fangen der Mann hinter dem MG1 trägt auf?

              What kind of field flask is the machine gunner wearing!?

              Danke - TJ

              Comment

                #172
                Das photo fur Post nummer 171.
                Attached Files

                Comment

                  #173
                  TJ:
                  What tunics are BW wearing in Post #169? 1956 is pre splittertarn period, I think. BGS photo is interesting too, especially use of K98. I suppose they wear short green field jacket in photo.

                  Klaus

                  Comment

                    #174
                    Klaus - I'm pretty sure the BW personnel are wearing the M1956 arbeitzug in mint condition with light blue shirts and a black four-in-hand tie worn underneath. The M1956 arbeitzug (pictured) that I managed to get my hands on is pretty beat up.

                    I'm not sure what the BGS personnel are wearing, but the short field jacket is a sound assumption.

                    TJ
                    Attached Files

                    Comment

                      #175
                      Klaus - Also note that the stacked Kar 98ks were post war models (see hexagonal stacking rod; no bayonet lug). These were made at the Mauser plant under French supervision and were issued to the French Foreign Legion in Indo-China as well as the BGS. (Source: Mauser Military Rifles of the World by R.W.D. Ball)

                      TJ
                      Attached Files

                      Comment

                        #176
                        Hi TJ,

                        your uniform in Post 174 irritates me.

                        Original are, in the first years (especially in 1956), sewn on rank insignia for EM and NCO, above at the sleeves.

                        Regards
                        Uwe

                        Comment

                          #177
                          Uwe - Sorry to irritate you. You're the second forum member I've managed to pi$$ off this week.

                          From the information I have available to me, I believe it is proper to display the feldwebel rank as shown in post 174.

                          In the attached diagram from Guido Rosignoli's book, Army Badges and Insignia Since 1945, NCOs from the rank of feldwebel and above wore their rank on their epaulettes from 1955 - 1957. The ranks of Stabsunteroffizier and below wore their ranks sewn to their upper sleeves.

                          The next posts will show period photos of feldwebels wearing the rank in the manner described by Rosignoli.

                          TJ
                          Attached Files

                          Comment

                            #178
                            This feldwebel is wearing his rank pinned to his epaulette. Wouldn't he wear a shoulder board if he had one? They wouldn't fall off as easy during field exercises.

                            I have 2 sets of feldwebel shoulder boards from the old days. They are both folded to accomodate the short space available on the Model 1956 Arbeitzug and Tarnanzug
                            Attached Files

                            Comment

                              #179
                              Here we see a feldwebel shoulder board sewn to the sleeve of an early falli Tarnanzug (source: Wehrmacht Camouflage Uniforms & Post-War Derivatives by Daniel Peterson).

                              Couldn't one assume that if he had an epaulette, he would wear his shoulder board there?
                              Attached Files

                              Comment

                                #180
                                Hi TJ,

                                a forum is for discussions.

                                Post 174 show a fatigue dress and not a "Tarnanzug".

                                "NCOs from the rank of feldwebel and above wore their rank on their epaulettes..."

                                Yes, and I must correct myself, but the first time in metal, as you can see it in Post 178 on the "Tarnanzug"



                                And this is the second version for officers (Lt - Oberst), the stars in silver.
                                The first version is with golden stars (altgold).

                                This an original worn fatigue dress from 1956, completely with the trousers.

                                Regards
                                Uwe
                                Last edited by speedytop; 02-04-2008, 06:54 PM.

                                Comment

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