Estonian Collar Tab

[Sturmmann]

Sturmmann, is it this book you helped with? Is it available in the USA?

yes it is the same book. You can buy from www.grenader.ee website - publishing house > history > eesti leegion sõnas ja pildis

This tab (with officer's piping) was on an Estonian forum which both Kass (moderator) and Sturmmann (owner?) participate. I don't read Estonian,
so I'm not sure what the verdict was, but its worth sharing here ! VERY SQAURE... ALMOST TOO SQUARE TO BE GERMAN MADE!

here is a better photo of the same 2nd pattern tab with officer piping. it is 100% original and made in dachau. to me it looks exactly as it should be and not square at all - maybe the photo nickg posted was taken from a bad angle and it looked a bit square?

Its clearly NOT a Dachau made one... but looks similar, just like the tab I sold to Dave (and taking back)...
Compare with post 27...very square looking, so is it the Estonian made "grandfather" (or prototype) of the Dachau tab perhaps?

imo it is very clearly a dachau manufactured tab. here is a photo of one 2nd pattern tab from one estonian collection - looks also square but it's because it is heavily damaged and just a cut piece from the tab.

Various 2nd pattern tabs in use here...metal ? and embroidered...
(or all cloth? or Dachau made / fieldmade?)
If this image was taken at Neuhammer, why weren't all troops issued the same tabs?

this image WAS taken in neuhammer and all troops WERE issued with the same tabs. all dachau made and embroidered. i have a very good quality scan of this photo somewhere in my computer - i will try to find it and post it here later.

Have you seen this one

yes i have seen this one. it is hard to tell if it's metal or embroidery probably metal.

Another variation with a slopy sword on the guy on the left

can't see anything wrong with the sword.

BINGO! Good example Askold, indeed a non-Dachau pattern embroidered Mailed Arm!
Its from Sturmmann's great web site looking at the source tag!
I think we have proof now of these being made prior to the Dachau official one!
Case closed as far as I'm concerned!

i didn't say that there weren't any metal or embroidered tabs made by estonian soldiers during the war (mostly 1943 - mid 1944). i am just saying that the tab nickg posted here before and which is quite similar to the official 2nd pattern tab is COPIED from the dachau made one and could not have been made by a soldier before the dachau 2nd pattern were issued to soldiers in october 1944. and because of the fact that it came with the similar square-like handmade blank rank tab it makes me believe that both tabs are fakes and made many many years after the war.

[Rene Chavez]

Interesting thread attached are a few pictures illustrating Estonian volunteers wearing non-Dachau collar tabs. Imagine if these types of collar tabs would pop-up some where collectors would probably jump to conclusions that it is a repro. I have more pictures in my reference files that show many Estonian volunteers wearing various types of locally made collar tab insignia I just need to search my reference files to find them. Anyway as Sturmmann indicated the standard were the official German approved collar tabs but as NickG also commented there were certainly many locally made insignia that was not approved by the Germans but nevertheless worn by the volunteers and should be accepted period examples with all collectors in general. Unfortunately as with all locally made insignia there are fakes in the mixture so one has to be very careful to decipher if the locally made item in hand is original or fake but studying it and only the collector will make the decision or the conclusion if he is happy with it or not just my 2 cents worth.

Rene Chavez
http://axis101.bizland.com

[estländer]

Origin of this symbol (E and hand with sword).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cross_o..._%28Estonia%29

Estonian Liberty Cross.

[espenlaub]

Unfortunately the biggest collectors in Estonia do not understand and cannot recognize crap from a textbook, even they call 100 genuine items as a fakes... But really I don't like the cloth on the first one.

i showed the picture of the tab to the biggest collector in estonia and he also said it's fake.

[espenlaub]

If I righ remember that one from the Allar's collection? As for it's story it's cannot be faked, due was found in the late of 80's- the time where that stuff was not a wide collectible

That tab is "badman" IMO

There is one hand embroidered E/sword tab in Estonian collection that has different opinions here. Good and bad. I do not know much about it and have no strong point of view (good or bad) cause lack of the info, but here are the pictures.

[Brandel]

Nice patches!
I have some like them,can somebody say something about them,because Im a new colector.
My dad give me it,he get it 1971. in Australia.








Greatings from Brandel!

[galizien41]

Pictures do not show up...

Nice patches!
I have some like them,can somebody say something about them,because Im a new colector.
My dad give me it,he get it 1971. in Australia.








Greatings from Brandel!

[Brandel]

Sorry that my pictures are not possible to see,Im new and have not much experiense...
Here is the second try:








http://sphotos-e.ak.fbcdn.net/hphoto...45143945_n.jpg

[baldy1939]

here is my signed photo of Harald Nugiseks SS-Unterscharführer which shows his tab , albeit not that clear .

[Askold]

Came across these photos, interesting use of "Tartu arm":