KM Small Coffee Cup and Soup Bowl

[David Fettes]

Can I ask you Loke, what are your thoughts on the photograph I posted showing plain coffee cups, yet the link and table shown (which I am assuming comes from a similar list that Stason showed) says these should have a coloured band.

[Loke]

...Loke, what are your thoughts on the photograph....

I can't see the photograph. No further thoughts, besides that collecting Kriegsmarine Porzellan and being diagnosed with Farbenblindheit would be a most unfortunate combination.

Regards, Loke

[compressore]

Same list

There are one 100% the proof.

It is the list of everything that it was necessary to take on the boat.

And except everything, porcelain is written down there:......

.

Just to make all aware that this is the same list I posted above in post #34.

The source is mentioned as:
1944 Reichs...amt Allgemeines Gerätesoll Bremen vom 11. IV. 1944 (mit handschriftlichen Ergänzungen für U-874) Seiten 12 - 17

I can not find any references of proof (where is the original ?) of this list which I would like to see as from a pure "scientific" point of view those those are just some typewriter written pages and do not have any worth in itself.

But I found another similar list for U-530 in the library of congress.

If this list has the same color differentiator, than we have a rock-solid proof.
http://findingaids.loc.gov/db/search...er%C3%A4tesoll

Maybe our US members can help to access this document ?

Also I think the questions by David are legit and deserves an answer in a proper manner.

Regards
Christian

[Edelweisse]

WOW...I want to thank all of you for this indepth discussion and info about Kriegsmarine porcelian.....I didn't know what I started but...I'm glad I posted the pictures. I have another coffee cup which has a red/brown trim that I "thought" was officer's since it is "fine china" vs. messhall porcelian. I have many pieces but the collections shown here are WOW! Again.....I'd like to say for all of us looking at this post.....THANK YOU!!!!!!

[David Fettes]

I too am enjoying this discussion, except for one or two who insist on making personnal remarks.

As for your other coffee cup Edelweisse, could you post a few photographs of it so we can see what you mean please?



.

[Edelweisse]

Here are pictures of KM with red/brown coffee cup w/small tea spoon

[Edelweisse]

More pictures of HM

[David Fettes]

Very odd shape and line is in keeping with the DAF system.

However I feel that the KM marking is fake. The reason being the eagles and the M would have been a transfer print, applied to the cup before glazing. On that one you can quite clearly see it has been applied using a stencil by a right handed person. They have pressed the ink from right to left, leaving a thicker line on the left hand side where surplus ink has collected.

[km-spain]

Hello David, I do not agree with you about the Eschenbach MWaA markings, you can find this kind of eagle marked in the same way on all the KM china made by this maker, some with the year and some with just the eagle+M.

I remember another thread with this discussion, but now I can not find it.

[Stason]

Very intersting film.
Part one shows the items with coloured bands, part two (also on youtube) shows the small coffee cups without any bands, which according to the list on post 28 they should not have had!

Also of interest, in part two, is the trick they play on the guy reading a book while on a hammock. The book in question is Anilin written by Karl Aloys Schenzinger, the same man who wrote Der Hitlerjunge Quex.

White porcelain was for sailors.
There is a photo which it proves:

We see at sailors simply white cups and at the officer a cup with borders.

[Stason]

Stason, an absolutely astonishing documentation. This might keep a few trolls away from my KM porcelain collecting thread, too. And, your collection is amazing. It must be the finest KM porcelaine collection out there. Well collected!



However, black/ silver striped KPM-produced porcelain with Kriegsmarine stamping do exist. Unfortunately not in my collection, but I have actually held an item in my hands. Kriegsmarine beamte officers had various silver-colored items instead of the for Kriegsmarine See-offiziere normal gold-colored ones: Uniform buttons, cap insignia, dagger hangers, cloth insignia..., the possibility for this black/striped silver KPM-produced and M-marked piece deriving from KM Beamte is rather large, wouldn't you think?

Best regards, Loke

Black / silver border does not exist.
I will explain the black / gold rim changes color depending on the angle at which the photo is made.

[Stason]

Here are pictures of KM with red/brown coffee cup w/small tea spoon

100% original cup.

This porcelain many collectors do not like. Eagle on the plate located on the enamel.

It later porcelain, I think by 1943.

[David Fettes]

Stason, in the photo you show the cups are too different sizes.

km-spain, the cups with the single red border do not fit into any of the ranking system that is assumed to be correct. Also 1943 dated canteen ware for Heer, Luftwaffe and Waffen SS are unknown to me. I have yet to see an example that I felt was original.

Also out of interest, Eschenbach canteen ware for Heer, Luftwaffe, Waffen SS, RAD and DAF all use a transfer print not a stencil.

[David Fettes]

Eagle on the plate located on the enamel.

Stason, do you mean it is above the clear glaze or below it?

[Stason]

Stason, in the photo you show the cups are too different sizes.

km-spain, the cups with the single red border do not fit into any of the ranking system that is assumed to be correct. Also 1943 dated canteen ware for Heer, Luftwaffe and Waffen SS are unknown to me. I have yet to see an example that I felt was original.

Also out of interest, Eschenbach canteen ware for Heer, Luftwaffe, Waffen SS, RAD and DAF all use a transfer print not a stencil.

Porcelain 1943: