Shoulder Board Cypher Question

[Hans Kristian]

The "Z" in gothic style is certainly for dentist. It was intruduced in early february 1942 (so before that, no-one could identify a dentist).

Here som pics from my collection, the first a dentist in tha rank of feldwebel, I am sure he would be stud. odont. and therefore a Fahnenjunker feldwebel (Z) i.san.korps.

[pauke]

z

This is not a gothic "Z" however.

[Hans Kristian]

Here a pair to an Assistenzarzt (Z) and a single to an Oberstabsarzt (Z)

Like the medical officers these insignia was in gold for officers and in white metal for dental students and unterärzte (Z).

[Hans Kristian]

Close-up of the oberstabsarzt (Z) and here also a pair for an Unterarzt (Z) which unfortunately are missing the Z´s - they were sew to the board.

If anyone is having one or 2 of these insignia lying around, please do not hesitate to contact me..

Hans Kristian

[Hans Kristian]

This is not a gothic "Z" however.

Well, you are right, but still the Z used by the dentist. Sorry for the mistake.

[Johnny R]

Then what is this upper case Gothic Z for? It was obviously produced. Was it used side by side with a Gothic P for Armored Trains (Panzerzug)? Or did manufacturers of these devices produce examples of every letter in the alphabet and the military picked and chose what and what not to use? Orders were not strictly adhered to when it came to insignia so isn't it possible that some might have chose to wear devices on their shoulder boards that might be out of the norm? What about the uberschube sporting green crossed shovel and pick with unit number.

Armored Trains (and some signals/supplementary officers used a "Pz" device that was one piece. Most of these "latin" "Z"s were used/produced for dentists.

[Tom Pearcy]

Unless it is an error on Angolia's part, He lists on page 376, vol. 1: Uniforms and Traditions of the German Army, Pz for Supplementary officers of armor units and PZ + number for Armored Trains (Panzerzuge).

[Johnny R]

Since you have that book take a look at the bottom of page 384. The PZ device for armored trains was gothic. PZ (latin) was also used as described on 384 by supplementary officers of armored trains and by signals units at Pz. Army level. The gothic device is shown on 376. The "Z" device in these images is the "Latin" "Z" described on 386 for destroyer units and 387 for dentists.

[Schulterklappen]

Font Fragen

Does anyone know if there was a definitive font used in the making of Fraktur and Latin cyphers used in board and strap manufacture?

[Tom Pearcy]

Look at page 357 (Gothic Letters) first row, second device from left. That is the one I am referring to, it is for Armored Trains. That upper case Z separately is the one in question.

[Tom Pearcy]

Close up of the cypher.

[Johnny R]

Look at page 357 (Gothic Letters) first row, second device from left. That is the one I am referring to, it is for Armored Trains. That upper case Z separately is the one in question.

The device is one piece, the drawing just shows the combination. The device itself is shown on 376.

[Tom Pearcy]

The device on the shoulder board you are referring to on page 376 is an Upper case, lower case (Pz) not upper, upper like the one in the drawing. We have yet to answer the original question: What is the upper case Fraktur/Gothic Z intended for?

[Johnny R]

I am not convinced that what you posted is a "Z" but that is just my opinion.

[Tom Pearcy]

It is most definitely a Z. I know type faces.

http://www.metropostcard.com/guideblackletter.html

Take a look at the bottom of the chart