Honestly...it's Beyond Words!

[djpool]

Why Weitze continues to misrepresent his pieces is beyond words. If the Waffenrock is original which I believe it probably is, why lie about the modifications. Its a rare item and as far as I know none of the enlisted ones were found complete. I don't recall seeing any with straps that are original to the piece. of course I've only seen 4 of them.

There is a market for original tunics with replaced insignia.Why ruin your reputation over a few EURO's. Hes just getting too greedy.

WR Jim

[NTZ]

Why Weitze continues to misrepresent his pieces is beyond words. If the Waffenrock is original which I believe it probably is, why lie about the modifications. Its a rare item and as far as I know none of the enlisted ones were found complete. I don't recall seeing any with straps that are original to the piece. of course I've only seen 4 of them.

There is a market for original tunics with replaced insignia.Why ruin your reputation over a few EURO's. Hes just getting too greedy.

WR Jim

Seems to be a pattern with him. Of course there are those that keep making excuses for him. "Hey one out of my 5 items I bought was good" Keep buying from him

[MLH13]

It seems Mr. Weitze is a bit upset with me for posting my displeasure of his GD Waffenrock here on the forum. I find it odd that he only replied to my concerns about the tunic after I posted it here on the forum.


Dear Mr. Hays,

today I have just received a note from a friend about your conversation on the Wehrmacht awards forum regarding the "GD" Parade tunic, which we have sold to you. I must say, that your behaviour is everything else then gentleman like. We only buy pieces, of which we are convinced and we do guarantee for every single item and take it back of course, whenever a customer is not happy. After your email with your complaints we have offered you immediately to return it back to us.

The fact, that you are not satisfied with the jacket is a different subject. Mostlikely you have never seen a real "GD" parade Waffenrock in your life before and so you never had the chance to compare our piece with another one. As a matter of fact, it is mostlikely the rarest of all WH Waffenrocks. In over 30 years this piece was my 3. "GD" em parade tunic, which I could purchase and they were all the same, including the way, how the shoulder boards are made and sewn into the tunic - it was a factory production. Even the cut of the Waffenrock is different to any ordinary WH parade Waffenrock: the sewing of the sleeves are in the old imperial style, so that the parade cuffs would sit directly at the stitching line (normal WH Waffenrocks have the stitching line on the inside of the sleeve). In deed I didn´t controll the sewings of the buttons, but there was absolutely no need for it, since the piece is all real. Be sure, that I will take a look, when the tunic is back and if you like to, I can still write you my result.

The tunic itself came out of the Military Museum of Mr. Klaus J. Peters in Kassel, which we have pruchased in November. Mr. Peters is a well-known collector for over 40 years, he was writing several reference books and his paratrooper + "Großdeutschland" uniforms and insignia are known by many serious collectors and experts, in Germany as well as in the USA.

Since you have already published your point of view including some of my correspondence on the forum, you are more then welcome to publish this message as well.

Further I am looking very much forward to your reply.



Best regards, from Hamburg,



Helmut Weitze

My response to Mr. Weitze's email above:

Mr. Weitze,

It seems you are a little upset with me. Why? I stated nothing but the FACTS on the WAF and I have every right to do so. Is there anything you read on the WAF that is not factual?

I sent you an email a couple of days ago asking you questions as to why you were not up front with me regarding your description the GD tunic. Why didn't you reply to my questions then? But now suddenly you feel compelled to write because your dirty laundry is being shown? And accusing me of being un-gentleman like? Please.

So, why didn't you tell me about the buttons on this tunic and how poorly they were re-sewn? This is definitely not the sign of a "textbook" tunic as you said. Perhaps you're unfamiliar with the proper period application of the buttons on a Waffenrock. And what about the shoulder straps? They are very questionable indeed and since when did the tailors of the period attach straps that leave gaps between the material?

At any rate Mr. Weitze, if you had been forthright in your description of this tunic in the first place...nothing would have been written on the WAF. I found it very appropriate to inform others on the WAF of this tunic so they don't run into the same disappointment as I did.

Good day

Mark Hays

[knopf]

Mark,why you make this theatre?
The tunic is 100% orginal in my IMO. By happy that you have the money and the chance to buy a piece like that.

[CWP]

It may be just me but I find the theory that the unusual application of the shoulder straps is a result of factory mass-production to be a plausible one. These special issue jackets were likely produced in one lot and not made by tailors. There is also the possibility that the surviving examples were prototypes which may account for the button stitching and the shoulder board application, if these were not really intended to be worn. I would have guessed that a faker or collector could and would have done a better job with the buttons. Just my opinion.

[MLH13]

Mark,why you make this theatre?
The tunic is 100% orginal in my IMO. By happy that you have the money and the chance to buy a piece like that.

This is about getting back to basics in our collecting world and one of the basics would be honesty in the description of the items we sell. Had Mr. Weitze given me a full description of the tunic before I purchased it, we wouldn't be writing about it right now. I guess the question is...what does "textbook" mean to you?

My intentions here are genuine and as I said before, I do not want anyone else to endure the same disappointment as I did. After all, if I didn't sound the alarm, do you think Mr. Weitze would have.

Mark

[djpool]

Personally I would love to own that tunic, if I had the money. Its a good price even if played with. I think the last one I recall being sold went for $10K and we're talking ten years ago. As far as the buttons being reapplied I don't recall how the other GD Waffenrocks had theres done.

The boards I don't know. As I said these were found in various condition as far as the insignia was concerned. But to me if the straps were added that would be a blessing. My friend Bob Hritz has a beautiful vet example without the boards. He has had no luck finding a pair of boards that match the condition of his tunic.

I'll continue to buy from Weitze. He gets great stuff, has a good return policy and has been easy to deal with IMHO. But does he dick with his uniforms. Yes, just like so many dealers do. I just don't believe the untouched stories anymore, so I can't be disappointed. As long as all the parts are original its good enough for me. I've seen too many tunics with professionally applied insignia thats impossible to determine if its been played with. I do know that Weitze has access to seamstresses that could have done a much better job on those buttons if he wanted. So I believe the tunic is exactly how Weitze got it.

Maybe someone who actually owns one of these tunics can post pictures of how the buttons and boards are sewn.WR Jim

[Johnny R]

Tunic

Mark,why you make this theatre?
The tunic is 100% orginal in my IMO. By happy that you have the money and the chance to buy a piece like that.

I did not chime in either because I do not want to start a thread War but I think this tunic is okay as well, the buttons may have been moved to resize the tunic but everything else is what I would expect to see for a piece that was not an issue item and more of a "probe" or a piece put together rapidly to use for the 1939 parade or propaganda etc. "Probe" in the German use of the word.

The main thing is you don't like it and have the right to return. I am sure he will honor it and indeed he could have added the things you noted in the description.

[Bob Hritz]

I really do not see the problem. Button thread color? I have never seen black thread that glowed UV purple, so am confused on that issue. So the button thread is black? Who cares? The tunic is very rare and desireable and Helmut will have no problem finding customers, at that fair price. Only a handful of these rare tunics were finished with shoulder boards, for the birthday party, and the others, without application of shoulder boards, were discontinied for the duration of the war (hence: forever).

I am just dissapointed that this public display of anger is necessary when there is never a problem with returning something to Helmut.

I think it is better to be positive about your concuslions before a public outcry.

Bob Hritz

[MLH13]

I really do not see the problem. Button thread color? I have never seen black thread that glowed UV purple, so am confused on that issue. So the button thread is black? Who cares? The tunic is very rare and desireable and Helmut will have no problem finding customers, at that fair price. Only a handful of these rare tunics were finished with shoulder boards, for the birthday party, and the others, without application of shoulder boards, were discontinied for the duration of the war (hence: forever).

I am just dissapointed that this public display of anger is necessary when there is never a problem with returning something to Helmut.

I think it is better to be positive about your concuslions before a public outcry.

Bob Hritz

Completely missing the point.

[John Pic]

I have only one question. How does black thread glow under UV light? I have never seen this and have experimented extensively with UV light on uniforms and threads. The only thing that can react to UV is phosphates or brighteners in white cloth or light colored cloth materials.

I must've posted simultaneously with Bob so I will add one more comment about the thread used ,it appears to be the correct thickness thread used for buttons during the time although Ive seen thinner twists used sometimes.Black has been used on more than a few.

MLH13 dont feel too bad I bought a tunic that really was put together post war...I believe by a member of this forum, and sold by Helmut Weitze. I reacted the same way..I think its the amount of money that causes this reaction,to some of us its a few years savings. Mr. Weitze worked it out with me later. Ive since liked doing business with him he is fast with delivery and easy to deal with through email.<SCRIPT type=text/javascript> vbmenu_register("postmenu_2369821", true); </SCRIPT>

[Johnny R]

I have only one question. How does black thread glow under UV light? I have never seen this and have experimented extensively with UV light on uniforms and threads. The only thing that can react to UV is phosphates or brighteners in white cloth or light colored cloth materials.

I must've posted simultaneously with Bob so I will add one more comment about the thread used ,it appears to be the correct thickness thread used for buttons during the time although Ive seen thinner twists used sometimes.Black has been used on more than a few.

Even if it lights up like a Christmas tree it does not mean it is "Wrong". IMO this is like buying a Porsche and complaining about the ashtray being too small. Just send it back, it probably is already sold again to someone who saw the thread .

[John Pic]

These days with non glowing threads sold and correct parts for restoration, youre right it doesnt matter. Alot of collectors were not so apprehensive about restoration many years ago.

[Johnny R]

Thread

These days with non glowing threads sold and correct parts for restoration, youre right it doesnt matter. Alot of collectors were not so apprehensive about restoration many years ago.

I have seen thread that glows I know if from WWI, it is atypical but it isn't wrong. I can see these leaving the factory with loose threads etc. if they were intended to be fitted latter etc. you just never know, Weitze certainly knows what he is talking about, he may have over looked the detail etc.

Anyway, he will take it back, only love is lost on this one.

[John Pic]

There is this stuff too ..