Originally posted by SJP
B. N. Singer
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Did I miss the answer to Steve's earlier question?
B. N. Singer -
Must have skipped over it. There is no bias material.JimOriginally posted by B. N. SingerComment
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Thank you Jim
B. N. SingerComment
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I'm not really a cap collector. I don't study them in detail to see the different variations. I'm also more comfortable with Artificial silk liners vs cotton or cotton/rayon blend liners. So I started wondering if there was a predominant color used for cotton liners. I checked 3 dealers sites(collectors Guild, Peter V. Lukas, Ruptured Duck) today and looked at Heer and SS M43s. There seems to be a lot of variations in colors. Unfortunately I'm assuming the caps shown are real. Its also impossible to tell if the materials rnatch in terms of weave etc.
The one I posted is at the top-Comment
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Fellas believe what you want to believe and hold it under the microscope,question it ad infiniteum..I m just telling you regardless of how they look and whether they are standard or non standard that they were produced for nazi germany before the end of ww2 and were brought home by us vets..All I can tell ya and I rest my case..Billbert
Although i dont think they were made at dachau
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Hi Billbert,Originally posted by billbertFellas believe what you want to believe and hold it under the microscope,question it ad infiniteum..I m just telling you regardless of how they look and whether they are standard or non standard that they were produced for nazi germany before the end of ww2 and were brought home by us vets..All I can tell ya and I rest my case..Billbert
Although i dont think they were made at dachau
I believe you.
I also know that there are collectors out there that aren't convinced. And I don't expect to win them over. I enjoy the discussion and the exchange of information. So I will try to provide evidence that supports my case. Hopefully the opposition will provide counter arguements. In the end neither side may budge. For me its not a matter of whose right or wrong, in the end I have to be happy with the item. I just like to have as much information as I can before I make that call. Plus the controversial threads are more fun than the old or
threads. That is as long as they don't digress into personal attacks.
WR JimComment
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Billbert, I personally believe youOriginally posted by billbertFellas believe what you want to believe and hold it under the microscope,question it ad infiniteum..I m just telling you regardless of how they look and whether they are standard or non standard that they were produced for nazi germany before the end of ww2 and were brought home by us vets..All I can tell ya and I rest my case..Billbert
Although i dont think they were made at dachau
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Gents, Here is another example. I've owned it about 20-25 years and don't recall ever questioning it until now. Has same type piping and appears to have been actually worn as body and liner are soiled and insignia is frayed in spots (of course that could have been done postwar). I see no bias material inside the turn-up. I'm normally the suspicious one so I want to know, real or repro? Interesting thread.Comment
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Any evidence of a full leather sweatband having once been (at the time of manufacture) in the hat?
B. N. SingerComment
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None that I can see although it appears that the lining stitching at the point where it meets the brim at the wearer's right front may have come loose at one time and has been re-sewn by hand....Originally posted by B. N. SingerComment
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Mike thank you very much for your pictures. You and Mr singer have also pretty much established the timeline when these showed up around mid to late 1970s. Boy if these were made by fakers they sure had their act together.
Your hat is sewn almost exactly like the one I posted. No doubt in my mind it was done by the same folks.
But your hat is made from different wool, has no sweatband, hard to tell but possible different color lining, and the hold downs are also from a different material.
Then they aged some of the stock to show field use and stacked others to simulate long term storage. Incidently the wear on yours is pretty damn convincing.
Maybe I'm delusional but I can't remember "Heer" repros being that sophisticated back then. I rarely saw totally remanufactured tunics or headgear. I think I handled one Panzer tunic. What I remember was a lot of foreign, old Bundeswehr tunics with insignia added. We were such a knowledgeable bunch back then that the repro artists fooled us with glued on insignia or stamped everything with swastikas. Heer items were still available. Now Panzer uniforms etc were still rare and desirable so the fakers were more elaborate. Original Field Grey wraps dyed black as well as headgear. Also had to watch for cut down greatcoats.
If someone wanted to make the perfect fake all the materials were out there. Bolts of original cloth, soutache, officer cord, buttons, lining material.Only thing I don't remember seeing was sweatbands but there were plenty of vintage headgear at the flea markets.
Here are a few comparisons of Mikes hat to the one posted.
WR JimComment
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Last oneComment
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As far as the crappy sweatband goes..On this style cap when worn in the field one might decide to remove it in the spring or summer..Within a short amount of time you could remove the entire lightly stitched band and never see evidence of it being there..Billbert
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