Development of Panzer throat mikes

[Nick Komiya]

Ah, do you mean that the brass band on one side did not have the Dfh.b marking that should have been there if they were Pz sets?

[me6_130]

Ah, do you mean that the brass band on one side did not have the Dfh.b marking that should have been there if they were Pz sets?

The headband had no marking, as far as I remember. The earphones were Dfh.a, I think.
I have another headband without markings but earphones are 'Dfh.b 44'

Carles

[me6_130]

Here they are:

[Panzer Rob]

A very interesting and informative thread, Nick

I'd like to thank you for taking the time to put this together and for continuing to add to it. I've learned quite a bit!

Rob

[Nick Komiya]

Rob, I'm glad I could be of help.

As this thread grew in scope to include the headset, perhaps it’s natural to include the cases that the headsets and throat mikes were kept in within the tank.
Here’s what they looked like. They would be fixed to the wall or the floor of tanks Stugs, etc. In this group photo the rusty one in the left of the middle row is in Elfenbein, an ivory interior color for early tanks that modelers often mistake as white, and equally often mistaken for dark yellow, the later standard ordnance color when you don’t have a dark yellow example to compare against, because it is quite yellow.
The inside of this earlier case shows felt padding throughout.

[Nick Komiya]

However, by 1944 padding was limited to the lid only.

And in what I consider to be a late model the padding is completely eliminated and the inside shows the primer color.

[Nick Komiya]

For those interested in more information about these cases should see this http://tiger1.info/EN/HeadphoneStowage.html

[nakta]

Awesome collection of Pz. headset cases. I clearly see the difference in color.

[FJCM]

Rob, I'm glad I could be of help.

As this thread grew in scope to include the headset, perhaps it’s natural to include the cases that the headsets and throat mikes were kept in within the tank.
Here’s what they looked like. They would be fixed to the wall or the floor of tanks Stugs, etc. In this group photo the rusty one in the left of the middle row is in Elfenbein, an ivory interior color for early tanks that modelers often mistake as white, and equally often mistaken for dark yellow, the later standard ordnance color when you don’t have a dark yellow example to compare against, because it is quite yellow.
The inside of this earlier case shows felt padding throughout.

Sorry if this question is off topic. But I´m very intrigued about these storage boxes...
I wonder why should they be painted in Dukelgelb when most of the interior was painted Ivory or, Later, left in primer...Are they from "open" vehicles like Marder et al?
The "later" models seem to be "light gray" in my screen. Is that its color or just another vversion of Dunkelgelb?
TIA

[Nick Komiya]

The dark yellow can either be from open selfpropelled artillery or even when the tank interior became oxide red, supplied by the manufacturer in the default ordnance color, which they did not repaint in primer at the tank factory. These cases were made by such companies as Prestag, Press u. Stanzwerkstätten in Berlin and as they would also be used on vehicles with exposed structures it would have been logical to finsh them in the default color of dark yellow.
Even when the tank interior was left in primer, the equipment from suppliers like radios, transformers, etc were supplied in ordnance colors, not primer. Color coordination was not the point. Dark yellow supposedly came in varying shades and never really uniform from what I read, so some have a weaker tone of yellow.
In this photo, the box on the left is for open vehicles, as it has a lockable latch that takes a pad lock. All the others are not lockable, so primarily intended for internal use. The middle is the early ivory. Note also the variantions in the latches.

[Nick Komiya]

Even Elfenbein is known to come in shades. Mine are pretty uniform, but here is a comparison of Elfenbein against dark yellow, so you have a better idea of the ivory or cream color.

[PANZERPIONIERE]

Nick, those cases are really cool! I would like to find one for sure, and I am still looking for those elusive red ear pads.
Steve

[FJCM]

Thanks for your pictures, I thought that only Elfenbein and Red were used on the interior walls of "closed" vehicles as per regulations.
I am more and more surprised with the many variations on colours, seen in German vehicles with a constant violation of issued orders and the constant change in shades of "standard" colours...Looks like Nazi Germany was not so strict and that nothing was written in stone (At least in this subject )
How many shades of Dunkelgelb have you seen as German militaria collector?
By the way : What´s the tube over the boxes for? Is a breathing mask tube container?

[Nick Komiya]

Yes, the tube is for the Atemschlauch ,gas mask cannister extension hose.
I don't think the regulations ever aimed at color coordination. Ivory must have been a matter of securing better vision inside the closed space, but painting ivory over the dark primer would have been very labor intensive requiring many coatings , so when they had to cut costs and expedite production they sacrificed visibility and eliminated the top coating of ivory and left it in the primer color. Also, the subject of the regulation must have been the inner finish of the shell of the tank, because that would have been an expansive area to paint and would have impacted the visibility most. It must have been the same principle as designating a specific wallpaper to be used for a room, because that paper happens to be a bargain or brightens up the room, but the furniture that goes onto the wall or against it is not really within the scope of that regulation. Of course what ended up in ivory would have depended on how much was already installed when the tank got the paint job, and what got installed after.
Regarding the different shades of Dunkelgelb officially there are supposed to be 3 variations that evolved, though they had the same RAL7028 designation.
The first was Dunkelgelb I, that used to be the standard color for German agricultural machinery in the 30s. The Reichsheer probably experimented with it, but it was not adopted for military use.
Then in 1942 field tests for a new ordnance color was conducted and a second variation of Dunkelgelb was officially announced in the Feb. 1943 Heeresmitteilungen No.183 as “RAL7028 Dunkelgelb nach Muster (according to sample)”, which was lighter and more yellower than Dunkelgelb I. This color, was used in production from March 43 until late summer of 44, but it was never officially entered in the RAL color register.
However, already in March 1943 RAL7028 “Dunkelgelb nach Muster” went through an adjustment that made it darker and less yellowish. This is sometimes called Dunkelgelb III, but officially it was called simply “RAL7028 Dunkelgelb” This version only came into use during late summer/fall of 1944, so it is also known as “Dunkelgelb Ausgabe 1944” when you want to buy paint for restoration for instance. But ironically, this was actually identical to Dunkelgelb I, the farm equipment color of the 30s, so things went full circle.
So in a nutshell, the 1943 Dark Yellow started out yellow and then turned darker and less yellow from around October 1944, not to mention the production variances that occurred within the same period.

[MG-Freak]

Hi Guys,

Great informative topic!! Maybe someone can help me.
Does anyone knows if this switch was used in tanks or were they only for aircrafts?