HJ Leaders Gold Sports Badge in wear

[sjl]

These badges, all versions...the numbered, the "B" version and the miniature are all maker marked RZM M1/101.
C
will edit to say too that the badge can be seen on both sides of the uniform in original photos, though not at the same time of course

The "L" RZM designation was used exclusively on leather (the "M" prefix was for "Metall"). It looks to me like a faker has grabbed any old RZM number to add to this badge without knowing much about it. The RZM mark and number also look hand stamped and not part of the die. Wouldn't touch it.

[Garry M.]

Here's a bit of info on these badges:

http://www.hj-research.com/forum/f25...ification-710/

The Goldenes Führersportabzeichen was introduced by von Schirach on the 6th of May 1938 and was awarded to those HJ and DJ leaders* who achieved a minimum points score of 7500 points (6500 for those aged 33 and over) in the 'Führer-Zehnkampf' or Leaders' decathlon.

The competition was held over the course of two days and was divided into two age-groups:
Stufe A: 18-32
Stufe B: 33 and older

*Gefolgschaftsführer and higher, Fähnleinführer and higher including those on the RJF staff, Gebiet staff, Bann staff and Jungbann staff.

All competitors had to already hold the HJ achievement badge in silver.

The events were:

100m
1000m
High-jump
Long-jump
Throwing club accuracy test
300m breaststroke
Small-calibre shooting
Cross-country navigation test

The badge was awarded for a period of five years and to continue wearing the badge after this point the leader had to achieve the required points total twice more within that 5 year period. This never actually happened because it was decided to suspend requalification until after the war. If a leader had failed to achieve requalification the badge would have been taken away.

A further part of the qualification criteria stated that any leader older than 35 who was able to satisfy the requirements of Stufe A would never again be required to requalify for the badge.

There is only one known maker: M1/101 Gustav Brehmer

The numbers of badges awarded varies depending on the source but it's likely to be somewhere between 12 and 15 thousand.

The badge was worn on the right breast pocket.

[juoneen]

Like some of the info differences such as : where it was to be worn ,or maker who supposedly was the ONLY one(wich i am still unsure that there couldnt have been others who may have made some to order), im still of the belief they wore them on both pockets as the photos prove...and...may not have been an exclusive to 101, although almost all ive ever seen are 101's.

This one being early dated, is still intriging ...that almost matches the one in the 1st photo exactly,...could have been a pp item, or there may be another answer,as 475 WAS a real maker.... and its that intrigue that makes me tend to swim against the current on this badge.

So to sort out wierd items like this is not easy, and many times the answers as to if it is a fake or original in some items May never be known for some of items such as this one, but sure make it interesting. Id say as always ...if its fake, (like some will, so here it comes) there must be more of them out there all over the place, and if not , why would anyone take the time to just make one unless its something they made few of at the 475 company, then never made any others for some reason. ( i know weve heard all the same arguments before )

The finish of the one in the photo also looks commensurate to the one i have thats unusually marked . It really is different , but it seems ive seen another makers mark other than 101 on some.....(if im not mistaken)...I also agree 100% ..your posted version is the usually accepted verison encountered, and a real nice one in fact with the mineature you have posted (kudos).

If this is a fake it is a very finely made example that took someone much work to pull off the details. But why the greenish paint ??

What shocked me was how much the one in the photo matched , as the one in the first photo doesnt appear like the ones in the other photos at all , especially in finish, as it is apparent by the infantry assaults brightness, and the brightness of the other badges in the luft photo that clearly shows the gold finish to be bright as in your version. The one worn by the army russian front vet is not bright as i have previously stated.

So thats whats got my consideration on the one with the L mark i expected to get negative remarks about, and would not have posted IF the photo had not been posted prior, as it leans toward my arguments on the finish being like this one.

If i hadnt shown the back, or even the close ups of the green paint traces , it looks the same to me, and thats why a close up on the photo may help.

On the L for leather , then why does some badges have an L without a slash, and others have the slash after the L ? I am not quite sure that L is only for leather when posted on a badge.( IMO.)

A better close up of the one in the first photo would be appreciated, but may be tough to get .

[stuart a.]

as far as im aware m1/101 brehmer was the only recognised maker of this badge, have never seen a good one by any other maker

[juoneen]

My hopes are because of the photo that started this thread...this may be one in that catagory, .. if anyone has any other makers marked HJGSB's Maybe they will post them.

[stuart a.]

sorry but if its not m1/101 then i would call it a fake

[DaveNZ]

Hi

One from my collection.

Cheers
Larry

nice pic larry: thanks for posting it

[DaveNZ]

Here's a bit of info on these badges:

http://www.hj-research.com/forum/f25...ification-710/

The Goldenes Führersportabzeichen was introduced by von Schirach on the 6th of May 1938 and was awarded to those HJ and DJ leaders* who achieved a minimum points score of 7500 points (6500 for those aged 33 and over) in the 'Führer-Zehnkampf' or Leaders' decathlon.

The competition was held over the course of two days and was divided into two age-groups:
Stufe A: 18-32
Stufe B: 33 and older

*Gefolgschaftsführer and higher, Fähnleinführer and higher including those on the RJF staff, Gebiet staff, Bann staff and Jungbann staff.

All competitors had to already hold the HJ achievement badge in silver.

The events were:

100m
1000m
High-jump
Long-jump
Throwing club accuracy test
300m breaststroke
Small-calibre shooting
Cross-country navigation test

The badge was awarded for a period of five years and to continue wearing the badge after this point the leader had to achieve the required points total twice more within that 5 year period. This never actually happened because it was decided to suspend requalification until after the war. If a leader had failed to achieve requalification the badge would have been taken away.

A further part of the qualification criteria stated that any leader older than 35 who was able to satisfy the requirements of Stufe A would never again be required to requalify for the badge.

There is only one known maker: M1/101 Gustav Brehmer

The numbers of badges awarded varies depending on the source but it's likely to be somewhere between 12 and 15 thousand.

The badge was worn on the right breast pocket.

Great piece of info there

were these badges ever made of zinc?

[sjl]

On the L for leather , then why does some badges have an L without a slash, and others have the slash after the L ? I am not quite sure that L is only for leather when posted on a badge.( IMO.).

You may be thinking about the LDO "L", which is an incompatible marking system with RZM numbering, and did not go as high as the number shown on the badge. In the format shown, it is definitely trying to be an RZM number, in which case the "L" can only stand for leather ("Leder"). This badge came under RZM controls as an official HJ badge, and would never be under the LDO.

A nicely made fake, but the back is wrong and the marking gives it away.

[Wim Vangossum]

Hi Juoneen,

I can easy understand your fascinated by this badge. It's not badly made. But the problem is: Even if someone made this badge -God knows for what reason- before 1945, you can't proof it. So every collector who knows that M1/101 was the only maker of these badges will not accept the one you showed. Of course it is intersting to think about who has took the time to make this copy, and mark it that way and used paint on it. But it brings you not any further. Maybe was the paint an attempt to make it look more aged? We will never now and just guessing around I'm afraid.

Regards, Theo
(Wim Vangossum)

[juoneen]

Its too bad you cant see it in hand, as it is certainly super well made, and has all appearances of real age . I also know , or should i say I knew the general consensus was the 101 was the exclusive maker. But i also know that the lower HJ awards were made by I believe, 15, 35, 34, 63, and 120. What had me scratching my head was the HJ ss division , and the photo that started this thread, as it appears so close I did a double take...
With 475 being a known maker of original ss hat eagles, and a while back i saw a 475 marked screwback Iron cross(marked on the screwback , sold on e bay) I just couldnt wrap my mind around how you get what appears to be a die struck badge , with no signs of fake ageing, or sloppiness in execution, and thought to myself...jump off the bridge...the differences are small, but quality is there. I also wondered to myself , how anyone could take the time to make such a quality badge, when even years ago, they didnt bring but a few hundred in the 60s, and that would be with a case, and all.
I dont know the answer, and dont know why the one in the photo matches so close. i also cant understand the use of the L or the number or the date. I may never know if this one could have been made in another country allied with germany, or what, as the logical choice for a maker to make would be the 101 for the mark if it was a faker item. The details still astound me. It has way too much workmanship to have been worthwhile for the little money it may have been sold for , even if it was a post war item. So im with you, Im trying to always find items that dont match fakes, but are outside the box , as I too have never seen one ever anywhere that appeared likethis one , except in the photo. Would you agree with me it looks just like the one in the photo.
Could the photo poster(nordmark) show a close up to the best of his ability if he hasnt already, as im starting at the end of the thread, and havent read any since yesterday? I would really appreciate it.

I will weigh, and measure it when i have time in a day or two, and if anyone wants to see another part ,i will even try and retake the blurry shots, so it can better be seen, as i said i took those shots over a year ago, maybe two. I believe the naysayers, wich i would most likely also be , if i hadnt had it in hand could hold it, they would understand how it just talk to you , and makes you want to scratch your head in wonder. Has anyone ever seen one like this anywhere else? Thanks again for all the comments , I am open minded always, and a little argumentative , in the spirit of playing the devils advocate.

[ravrick]

Hi, this is my badge, a nice worn original

[ravrick]

The rear

[stuart a.]

ravrick nice original badge ,juoneen its your badge and if you are happy with it thats great but its documented that only brehmer made these badges so it cant be a genuine piece, but as i stated its your badge if you have belief in it good for you
stu

[Nordmark]

On request: