UB Austrian badge in the Third Reich

[ferdinandmax]

This badge was worn by submariners Austrian KM in the third Reich

[Norm F]

Hi ferdinandmax,

This has the appearance of a cast production. What research and history can you tell us about this item?

Best regards,
---Norm

[Norm F]

Here's an old thread on GMIC on these badges:
http://gmic.co.uk/index.php/topic/45...-u-boat-badge/

Here's a description by "Ian" from that thread:

"I have been researching the U-Boat badge for some time and here is a short version of some of that research.

The Imperial and Royal Austro-Hungarian Navy (K.u.K. Kriegsmarine) adopted
a distinctive badge for wear by the crews, but excluding officers, of their
submarines in October 1910. (Verordnungsblatt No.48 dated 15th October
1910).

The badge measured approx 56mm high x 36mm wide, was silver in
colour and consisted of the letters U and B either side of a fouled anchor.

The badge was awarded after having completed at least one voyage as a
member of a submarines crew.

No written or photographic evidence has been located to indicate that
the badge was issued to Officers. (Happy to be corrected).

Photographs showing Officers wearing the U-boat qualification badge are
post World War I, and indeed, most show former Austro-Hungarian Officers/sailors
serving in the German Kriegsmarine during World War II. Konteradmiral Paul
Meixner is often seen in wartime photos wearing his Austro-Hungarian U-Boat
badge.

The official issue badges were die struck and featured a full length,
wide ‘Spange’ mount or clip. This type of mounting arrangement was common to
most Austro-Hungarian period badges. The badge was made of brass (thio metal?)
and was silver in colour.

One known maker of this badge is BSW (Bruder Schneider Wien). Jewellers made pieces were also available
for private purchase.

Note: The badge continued to be manufactured after 1918 and well into the 1950’s by the firm of Rothe of Vienna (other jewellery companies may also have manufactured thebadge). These badges were produced to satisfy those veterans who required replacement pieces. The badges were generally manufactured with a needle pin and catch arrangement.

Regards,

Ian"

[Norm F]

Here's one on eMedals (asking $1250) that looks quite different. I have no idea what are the features to distinguish a WW1 issue from post-war replicas.
http://www.emedals.com/highlighted-o...t-badge-eu7239

[Norm F]

The examples posted by Bill ("WJT") from his collection and his description:

"My grandfather was assigned to U-IV from 1913 to 1916. When I got qualified in the US Submarine Service he gave me his U-Boat badge. Since then I have been collecting AH u-boat badges, some reproductions and many fakes. The fakes were intentional. I would like to know if anyone has information and/or references on makers, hallmarks, periods made and where they were made and where they are currently being made.

Here is my collection - No 1 was my grandfather's
#2 is a copy of #1 that a friend of mine cast in silver from a mold he made of the original.
#'s 3 & 4 look authentic but the BSW Hallmarks are the same but differ considerably from #1. These may have been veteran's pieces or jeweler made pieces.
#5 & 7 I was told were fakes because of the smell. I have seen the clip on #5 on a museum copy being sold on the web so maybe it is one of them doctored. #7 has the same patina as #4.
#6 has a screw back and I believe it to be made in Poland or Czech Republic. Got it for $18.00

None of the pin backs are marked and probably reproductions because none of them really cost that much.

#8 – 10 looked like novelty pieces. #11 I received from a group I belong to in Salzburg Austria. #12 appears to be a period sweetheart pin with a five pointed starfish hallmark. #13 appears to be a period stick pin. #14 is a commemoration pin Welt Krieg 1914 -1916 Hochsee-Flotte. #15 cap badge. #16 stamped badge gold and silver color. #17 same as 16 but silver color back. #18 & 19 stamped, look to be made by the same maker. #20 is like #18 but aged. #21 beautifully finished but like current anodized finishes. #22 stamped like it is done in bright silver."

[Norm F]

Here's one from Jamie Cross's website which is described: "This exact one is shown in the book "Torpedo Los" by Gordon Williamson on page 386."
This is perhaps the most convincing looking example so far?

[ferdinandmax]

Here's one on eMedals (asking $1250) that looks quite different. I have no idea what are the features to distinguish a WW1 issue from post-war replicas.
http://www.emedals.com/highlighted-o...t-badge-eu7239

this is copia

[ferdinandmax]

The little is 2 war world

[Norm F]

Another from the net:
http://www.ww1medals.net/WW1%20IMPER...BADGES%201.htm
"courtesy of Bill Tilton, MMCS(SS) USN, Ret."
I don't know if this is the same Bill who posted his collection on GMIC, but it's one of the "BSW" marked pieces.

[ferdinandmax]

the badge comes from family, unfortunately the photos have kept them, from the photos you saw sailors of World War II with badge UB Austrians

[Norm F]

This photo is poor but this one (#31) is a reproduction, sold on the net for $25 each. Too bad we can't see the reverse.

[ferdinandmax]

zszszs

[ferdinandmax]

zszszs

[ferdinandmax]

zszszsza

[ferdinandmax]

szszsx