New Addition - Nickel Silver Juncker PAB

[fischer]

A very nice addition Tom...congrats on adding this lovely example to your collection...

The NS Juncker is my favorite as well, here is my example.

Best regards, fischer

[Eddie]

Wow this thread just become real eye candy

here is mine,this one is mint but more boring IMO then examples with patina.

Chris and Fisher your examples is

kind regards,

Eddie

[robinhood]

Something about juncker that make the long search worth the wait. All very nice guys, Well done tomas for finding that baby .
Regards Rob

[Aurora68]

Hello all,

a great threat with stunning badges...let me show you my two favourite PABs

Kindest regards

Martin

[Aurora68]

here the second Juncker NS

[Den]

Wow, almoast impossible to find one of these ns junckers, but you did Tom, beautifull badges , all of them.

[PAB_Collector]

Great badges guys!

[Nordmark]

What makes me wonder is why some say that these never got a finish, imo you see traces of it on every neusilber piece.



Regards,


Daniel

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Daniel,

I will check again on mine tonight, but I am pretty sure that mine didn't receive any finish. Where do you see traces of silver finish on mine?

If it did receive a finish, I think we would see it on the catch, and I see no trace of finish in that area. Its possible that the catch was applied AFTER the finish, but there is bound to be SOME traces of finish left over on a badge made of such high quality base metals such as Nickel Silver. I see no traces at all...

Tom

[Nordmark]

Hi Tom,




imo the traces of finish are clearly visible, they are simply worn off. If you look closely you will find that the deeper contours still hold some sort of finish, while on the highlights, it is worn off. Note that these deep contours appear to be much rougher than the parts where you see the neusilber.

It is illogical to me, that the highlights look polished, while the deep contours of the badge show what many people call patina. Imo these are remnants of the former finish, that started to change its colour.

I attached a picture of your badge and a picture of a neusilber IAB. You can still see the silvering on the IAB, while the highlights show the bare neusilber. What is the reason for this? In my opinion the developing of patina could never roughen a material like neusilber.

Regarding the backside of the badge, it is nearly the same. These badges show a strong discoloring on the bachside, with the same roughness of the deep parts. I attached another picture of my Juncker, note how the two badges share the same pattern of darkening.

It is the same with the Mayer IAB for example. If you look at the worn frosted pieces, you will also find the bare brass on the worn highlights, while the deep contours still hold remnants of the frosting.

All this leads me to the conclusion, that all of the so called Juncker pieces received a thick frosting, that wore off.

I attached two pictures and I hope you see my point.



Kind regards,


Daniel

[Nordmark]

....

[Thomas Durante]

Hi Daniel,

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I am at home now and have looked very hard at the PAB and I am still 100% positive that mine didn't receive any silver finish. The badge looks shiny in some places because that is where the nickel silver is worn down from years of rubbing and that is why is looks different.

Your IAB on the other hand clearly has a white frosting applied to it. I still see plenty of traces of it on the recesses of the obverse and then ofcourse all over the reverse. You can also see the frosted finish on the brass catch, whereas on my PAB there is absolutely NO sign of white or silver finish on it.

I don't doubt that SOME nickel silver PABs may have been frosted white like your IAB was done, but just not on my PAB or some others I have seen and handled. I think that was the whole reason why Juncker wanted to use Nickel Silver in the first place.....so they could eliminate the need for a separately applied finish. Tombak badges HAD to have a silver finish, but a badge made from Nickel Silver didn't because no matter how much wear, they would still appear Silver. The same can be seen with most of the early LW Para badge makers......they chose Nickel Silver for the wreath instead of tombak so they didn't have to apply a silver plating to the wreath. The eagle, on the other had was SUPPOSED to be gold colored, so they ALWAYS used tombak for the eagle (never Nickel Silver).

Tom

[Nordmark]

Hi Tom,



I still doubt that these never got a finish. What do you think is the reason for the discoloring and the rough surface on the marked spots? Patina is simply oxidation, it can´t roughen a surface like on these Neusilber badges. Something was applied on these spots, that now lost its color.

Why are these spots so different from others? Maybe you will see where I am coming from by looking at this Mayer IAB. Note the rough reverse where the frosting was applied. Imo this looks exactly like the highlighted spots on your badge, also it looks the same on the reverse on every Juncker badge that is posted in this thread. If you use a toothpick or some other wooden tip to scratch gently on these spots, you will note how rough these spots are, compared to the worn, bare Neusilber parts.



Regards,


Daniel

[Indy]

Tom,
One sweet badge. My NS examples weigh in at 17.45 and 18.60 I have a cut-out but no point in weighing it for obvious reasons. Nickle Silver Juncker examples are at the top of the food chain in my opinion.

Chet

Chet,

when you said "top of the food chain"....do you mean Porsche 911 GT2 RS?

[Indy]

Tom,

Nice NS Junker PAB.

Every man needs to get his deam toy. Congrats! You should ask Giel earlier, he got a truck load of NS Junker PAB in his back yard.

I can't find my NS Junker PAB. I'm going to check some more boxes in my new place. Wait.......Tom, your new NS PAB looks familiar with me. Is it possible that..........