That one is mine with the blunt 3 . I got on on the way still and have to look for others . Not surprizing to me at all that it has a W&L core .
Douglas
Douglas
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Robert : is your jump ring solderd on or melted on ?
DouglasComment
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Here is the reverse of the 3-flaw Juncker with the W&L obverse...
RobertComment
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Yes .
Some mixed core types I was aware of , but had not mentioned . This 2nd tear drop type has a lot of surprises yet .
There those with the 2 different jump rings , those with the 2 different frame materials and different trimming tools , those with and with out the pointy 3 reverse .. so a W&L and Juncker reverse and those with W&L paint and the Juncker paint and even still another variation on the front date ... no chip and chip !
I have one with W&L paint and one with the Juncker paint .
DouglasComment
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Lot of variations, yes.
Here is the soldered joint you inquired about...
RobertComment
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Yes, the back of all the 3's are pointed on the 'crunch-bead' Junckers. Very typical. Looking through my (8) W&L EKII's only one has the pointed-back '3'; all others are the blunt-back.Originally posted by streptile View Post
So MANY variants!
RobertComment
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I have not mentioned all the variations on this peticular one yet and ther are some more real surprizes to this one yet .
The sample you are showing is one of 3 types of mounting . Using same metals - as it appears to be on yours - no added material is used , as the heated surfaces just melt into each other . In other case an outside soldering material is melted between and around each part to hold them together - creating these 'bloby' welds .
DouglasComment
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Yes, the backside joint is a 'blob', as you call it (rod added to heated metal), but I still believe the upper joint (in the photo) could not have been made without add-rod. I've been a welder for 30+ years, and the only way to achieve this appearance is to heat both surfaces and run them together under pressure. And, it still wouldn't take on this appearance. I still believe the joint was made with add-rod.Originally posted by Douglas 5 View Post
RobertComment
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Well .. from all the 3 flaw framed Juncker EK2s I have taken pictures of I have 11 that are pointy and 4 that have a blunt 3 . There are a few new ones I have not taken pictures of yet . The 3 full W&L EK2s have a blunt 3 .
DouglasComment
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I think I understand what you are referring to, Douglas. A seperate piece of metal is added inbetween the joint, and when heated, creates the fused joint. In pipe welding we call this a consumable insert. A fancy word for add-rod. Ha Ha!
RobertComment
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Yes, the W&L's predominantly have the blunt-3's, although some Junckers have them as well. Whoever manufactured these crosses, whether W&L or Juncker, had two (or more) reverse dies on hand.Originally posted by Douglas 5 View Post
RobertComment
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Could both sides have been heated at the same time and the add-rod only applied to one side ? This would account for why many jump rings break away on one side only . And then the soft - lower temprature - solder holding the halfs --- would it not run or open ?
DouglasComment
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Robert - remind me later : One of your W&Ls has a pointy 3 , would like to see that one .
DouglasComment
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Funny you should say that. Mine has broken in the heat-effected zone of the joint on the back side, and it is only held by the obverse joint. If one was to 'starve' the joint of sufficient solder it could possibly snap. But not likely. Cooling it prematurely could make it break. Welding it with a lower grade of silver solder could cause it to become brittle, and break. To answer you original question, yes, both joints could be soldered at the same time, and most probably were from time to time. But, I think the common method in joining the frame halves together was one joint at a time. The silver or tombac was ductile enough to withstand the bending process in joining the halves over the core once the joints had cooled.Originally posted by Douglas 5 View Post
Robert
RobertComment
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