Early ZB and THW items

[keith23]

Hi Steve, it's defo' grey, a little washed out compared to the dark grey version in Hoovers photo and defo' not khaki.
There's no markings at all except the little white and red size label, "48"

[hoover]

The Anoraks of the tan version were manufactured in grey, too.
So I will bet on THW or late LSHD.

[Gordon Craig]

Steve,

Right on with colour variations. The anorak in question looks lke a lighter grey than the THW anorak pictured here, at least on my screen, but we are all probably seeing it in a different colour.

Regards,

Gordon

[Collectinsteve]

OK! So it is more gray than khaki, but not dark gray like the more familiar later THW/ZS items. With this color confirmed it appears Hoover has been able to identify it as THW or LSHD. Based on the evidence in front of us I think that is a safe bet. Narrowing down who and when it was worn is certainly out of my area of expertise

Steve

[Gene T]

For those of you in the US who are interested in getting a ZB Einsatzanzug, but missed out on Steve's private auction a few months ago, have a look at this:

http://www.sportsmansguide.com/net/cb/cb.aspx?a=695559


If you have bought European surplus clothing from SG before, you know that their sizing and condition grading are no more than 50% accurate. Since these jackets are dirt cheap, I ordered three - two large and one medium - just to get an idea of what they actually have.

I received a size 52 and a size 48 for the two large I ordered, and a second size 48 for the lone medium. Whoever sorted these for size must have relied on the eye-ball method rather than the (more time-consuming) label-reading method. No surprise here.

All three jackets are navy blue, just as illustrated in their catalog. Condition ranges from near new (for the 'large' size 48) to well worn (the 'medium' 48, which had shrunk due to washing). Two jackets are '63 dated, one is '66 dated.

All three garments are liberally garnished with 'period' dirt and (rust?) stains! It's as though they were collected right after some type of disaster drill (or maybe an actual disaster?) and promptly put away and forgotten, until they were rediscovered and surplused.

One of the more unusual and interesting offerings SG has had in a while.



Gene T

[Collectinsteve]

Hi Gene!

Glad to see you back in action. I saw the Sportsmans Guide offerings this week as well (just got the catalog, probably like you!) and wondered if the quality was decent. Glad to hear I'm not the only one that uses the shotgun approach to SG ordering. One benefit is sometimes you wind up with more than one variation of pattern!

For me, I'm out of the non-BW, non-Polizei/BGS market. I've got a bunch of stuff from this thread's early posts still hanging around for sale/trade, but the bulk of it has found new homes already.

Steve

[Gene T]

The downside of the shotgun approach is that you may have to remodel your house sooner rather than later in order to accommodate your addiction :-)

I'd pay to be a volunteer helper at the HQ section of SG's warehouse for a week. I think they should offer that as a reward, after you've bought a certain quantity of merchandise from them, perhaps based on tonnage.


Gene T

[Collectinsteve]

Heh... I have often thought that if I were given a half day at SG's warehouse I would need at least one 18 wheel tractor trailer rig to take my stuff home

As a guy with a basement full of extra Swiss and German camouflage, I agree the shotgun approach has its downsides. However, when I ordered the 20 pack of Flecktarn shirts and found a half dozen variants I didn't know about, I was not at all unhappy!

Steve

[Gene T]

These boots just fetched EUR 162 on German eBay:

http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...663995033.html





The buyer probably agreed with the seller's assessment that these came from leftover WH stock.

I have no problem believing that individual pairs of mint Knobelbecher can be found throughout Germany at the end of the war, but it's quite something else to believe that there could have been a large enough stock of these stashed away somewhere during the war to actually outfit the THW years later.

Besides, while the materials and construction details seen on this pair of boots generally resemble those found on the earlier WH Knobelbecher, the lack of half soles, those bulbous toes, and the yellow-striped pull straps are all red flags for the typical WH footwear collector we encounter today.

Given that all THW uniforms and equipment we've seen so far in this thread had been designed and made specifically for the organization, it's not difficult at all to imagine that these boots were an integral part of that effort.

These may or may not be of WH origin, but they are unquestionably THW, as they literally bear the organization's brand.


Gene T

[Collectinsteve]

Cool set of boots! Brown, however, was not a common boot color for the Third Reich, so I doubt they came from that time period. Instead, I think it is more likely that these were VERY early THW boots. Remember THW started in 1950 and Germany was still in economic dark ages in many respects. Cobblers would likely have stuck with traditional techniques at first until things got more organized and "exotic" things like rubber soles got brought into the mix.

Just one man's guess

Steve

[Gordon Craig]

Gene T,

Thanks for the photos of the boots. Nice to see a pair that are well marked like these are.

Regards,

Gordon

[Gordon Craig]

Some more shirts. A brown short that Hoover posted before as LSHD although this one is marked ZB.

[Gordon Craig]

A green shirt in the same style as the LSHD/ZB ones except for the colour and it does not open all of the way down the front. Similar to some BGS field shirts that I have.
So who wore this style of shirt in green?

Regards,

Gordon

[Gordon Craig]

The only markings in this shirt.

[Collectinsteve]

Several Polizei forces used a pale green shirt like this prior to the 1976/78 change over. But the ones I have, I think, have provisions for shoulder rank. I'll try and check.

Steve