Announcement

**Daniel.S** · 04-01-2016, 08:47 AM

Originally posted by RobertE View Post

Does anyone know for a FACT that Lorenzo manufactured the covers which are held as replicas? Or was he just one of dozens of sellers who had these as well as other items and sold them as real? I have read the threads; there is no evidence he made them.

Does anyone know for a FACT he was witting to the covers and other items being faked, and made a decision to sell them for "profit and greed"?

I can tell you that many big name dealers whom I have bought from directly and indirectly bought into various caches of items and sold them, and the items were bad. I have been burned by rock-solid provinance that turned to jello - how would anyone feel if the last cache of helmet covers turned out to be bad? Would everyone who bought and sold one be part of a huge conspiracy? Of course not.

If he made them and sold them as real, that's obviously wrong and he rates this online berating. But if he was just one guy out of a dealer base selling these unwittingly, this is just WAF witch-hunting.

s/f Robert

you could ask one of the moderators...

Originally posted by Willi Z. View Post

The recent victory is that we nailed the faker of SS camo, especially covers, and we booted him from the forum. But it took effort. We had suspicions, like in many of the above, but it took reaching out to those who had been offered fake covers in exchange for originals. The dealers protected their source, but it took talking to people and getting them to add facts to the suspicions to come forward. Will it stop him from moving fakes? Nope....

**90th Light** · 04-01-2016, 08:54 AM

Originally posted by Ian Hulley View Post

Hi Chris, not Mark, but there are a few fakes in there including one or two things which other specialists were unhappy about.

Let's not derail the cover thread though

Cheers, Ian.

Thanks Ian,

and I can see what you are saying, that a few items in the Brando/ Beaver SS insignia book are controversial in the opinion of some collectors.

Well I repeat that I have a lot of respect for the book and have not regretted getting it.

Given that Tony has now started a thread in regard to this matter;

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=854295

Lets list the items that are in question on that thread and see what the collecting community of WAF think of them. It has been my experience that advanced collectors/ authors of the caliber of Mark Bando and the late Mike Beaver would include such items for good reasons. May be even a veteran connection.

Regards,

Chris

**viva_giulio** · 04-01-2016, 10:57 AM

Originally posted by kammo man View Post

Read the linked thread and stop being a baby

Owen may be my english is not good...
Do you understand thse cover do not come from Italy and has 30 years old history?
Do you understand were made hundreds and given to dealers?
Do you understand people provides to give zelth clips and so on ?
Do you under stand if Lorenz ask to make these covers ALSO for him there is a shop whichbgiven covers fornyears to dealers?

Yes we can think Loren have a quantity of these. Yes we can think he sold in trades, he furnished dealers but... The man who sewn and cut zelth was the same of previous years.

Are you interested to discover him?
Are moderators and high level old collectors ready to speak about this story?

If not... Talk again and forever about Lorenz and italiannfake.
Some our top dealers will be very happy.

**kammo man** · 04-01-2016, 11:07 AM

Yes I know all about it 100%.

**jacquesf** · 04-01-2016, 11:34 AM

It seems kammo man, has become....... ammoman. Let them fakers have it. Superhero in the fight against fakes. There definitely a movie in here somewhere.J

**Hundestaffel** · 04-01-2016, 11:44 AM

Originally posted by jacquesf View Post

It seems kammo man, has become....... ammoman. Let them fakers have it. Superhero in the fight against fakes. There definitely a movie in here somewhere.J

That Movie better have PINK Smocks !!!

**kammo man** · 04-01-2016, 11:53 AM

Originally posted by jacquesf View Post

It seems kammo man, has become....... ammoman. Let them fakers have it. Superhero in the fight against fakes. There definitely a movie in here somewhere.J

This whole fakers thing is beyond boring to me
Day in
Day out
Bla bla

However good guys got burnt hard and that's a tough pill to take

Lorenzo offered me his covers directly and I put 2 and 2 together
If that had not happened to me then I would be on the other foot on this matter.

Weird nasty hobby

**Scott A. Hess** · 04-01-2016, 11:53 AM

Originally posted by viva_giulio View Post

Owen may be my english is not good...
Do you understand thse cover do not come from Italy and has 30 years old history?
Do you understand were made hundreds and given to dealers?
Do you understand people provides to give zelth clips and so on ?
Do you under stand if Lorenz ask to make these covers ALSO for him there is a shop whichbgiven covers fornyears to dealers?

Yes we can think Loren have a quantity of these. Yes we can think he sold in trades, he furnished dealers but... The man who sewn and cut zelth was the same of previous years.

Are you interested to discover him?
Are moderators and high level old collectors ready to speak about this story?

If not... Talk again and forever about Lorenz and italiannfake.
Some our top dealers will be very happy.

I would sure like to know

How about a PM?

**Sal Williams** · 04-01-2016, 11:57 AM

Originally posted by Scott A. Hess View Post

I would sure like to know

How about a PM?

I want to know why it is always a secret.

**Scott A. Hess** · 04-01-2016, 12:00 PM

Originally posted by Sal Williams View Post

I want to know why it is always a secret.

Me too! If its so well known and has been for years, and I'm not saying it hasn't..why would one not want to inform others, saving collectors from the loss, and the makers and sellers from the profit? Seems pretty straightforward. The only reason it would seem not to disclose is if someone has something to gain by not doing so. If I were aware of someone making such items, I'd sure share such information, but that's just me.

**Bax** · 04-01-2016, 02:49 PM

Just to summarice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Willi Z. View Post
The recent victory is that we nailed the faker of SS camo, especially covers, and we booted him from the forum. But it took effort. We had suspicions, like in many of the above, but it took reaching out to those who had been offered fake covers in exchange for originals. The dealers protected their source, but it took talking to people and getting them to add facts to the suspicions to come forward. Will it stop him from moving fakes? Nope....

+
The recent tread on this topic:
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=841522
+
The old tread the topic:
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...ight=francesco

It should be clear that somethings has been ongoing, I am sure that some people have more details, some does not wan´t post all details etc. We have discussed why single dealers will not confront such, even if they knows in public, thats why the moderatos did their homework and made some actions based upon that. Just if people keep secrets does not make it right or make fakes original.

Thanks for all comments

Rgds
Pål

**FrenchVolunteer** · 04-01-2016, 03:08 PM

Hi,

i think that this is the time for a new anonymous blog that will tell the whole story in detail...

By the way is there a link with the "pink smocks" saga ?

See You

Vince

**Dennis J** · 04-01-2016, 04:08 PM

Originally posted by djpool View Post

Sounds like what some early authors of dagger books did i.e. show fakes in the book in order to establish provenance and then sell the fakes as real, citing the book as the proof of their originality.

So true.
Dennis J

**kammo man** · 04-01-2016, 04:14 PM

Originally posted by FrenchVolunteer View Post

Hi,

i think that this is the time for a new anonymous blog that will tell the whole story in detail...

By the way is there a link with the "pink smocks" saga ?

See You

Vince

No pink link.

This is a different way more expensive swindle

Pink was a rookie entry level fun park compared this one

**FrenchVolunteer** · 04-01-2016, 04:27 PM

HI,

thanks Owen, yes it seemed that the helmet cover swindle is far more "complex".

See You

Vince

Announcement

Camo coming from Lorenzo - Helmet cover

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