SS Officer's eagle on tunic

[John Pic]

I've seen it both ways but I would think a tailor would prefer to put the pips in later if machine sewing the tabs on. However these type pips fold inward so the sewing would not be so difficult with a machine. You see a lot of hand applied SS tabs so the pips are just left on and don't need to be removed to sew it on that way.

[Scott A. Hess]

I've seen it both ways but I would think a tailor would prefer to put the pips in later if machine sewing the tabs on. However these type pips fold inward so the sewing would not be so difficult with a machine. You see a lot of hand applied SS tabs so the pips are just left on and don't need to be removed to sew it on that way.

Makes sense, thanks for your help John.

[SgtB]

That generally happened after promotions when possible IMO. It was easier to just change the pips/strips around than to remove the whole tab.

[mel]

So my gut feeling was right....I kept looking at the eagle and was worried about it...

I just checked with my friend and he confirmed that he and another collector went to the house of the SS veteran in 1996. This veteran showed them "his" tunic after which the collector and the veteran set themselves apart and finalized the sale....he paid a large sum for this tunic....

It sounds like an intentional rip-off setting...in which this old german man was involved to make the story look believable; one can wonder whether this guy actually was an SS veteran or not... One can only wonder how many of his "own" tunics the veteran has sold in those days to collectors....

Does anyone know of other similar experiences with regard to the sale of SS tunics of this HSC company?

[John Pic]

They used to publish their items in a Militaria magazine with people wearing them to recreate scenes from WWII. There was an intercompany dispute and one person spilled the beans in a long letter describing how they created the uniforms, the letter leaked to the internet . They had a tailor and used insignias by Sieder company of Vienna. Johannes Floch sold many of these loose at Militaria shows around the World. I used to keep a copy of the letter but not anymore because the tunics are so numerous with Sieder insignia no proof is needed they are faked. A company on the East Coast that went out of business used to sell these exclusively as original N&T Global was their name. Ill attach some pictures of faked tunics with Sieder insignias. It would be nice if once discovered they were sold as Reproductions they aren't bad as fillers.

[John Pic]

This one was offered to me by Bruno Caravano of HSC some years ago.

[DKNYC71]

So my gut feeling was right....I kept looking at the eagle and was worried about it...

I just checked with my friend and he confirmed that he and another collector went to the house of the SS veteran in 1996. This veteran showed them "his" tunic after which the collector and the veteran set themselves apart and finalized the sale....he paid a large sum for this tunic....

It sounds like an intentional rip-off setting...in which this old german man was involved to make the story look believable; one can wonder whether this guy actually was an SS veteran or not... One can only wonder how many of his "own" tunics the veteran has sold in those days to collectors....

Does anyone know of other similar experiences with regard to the sale of SS tunics of this HSC company?

There are many such stories here in the US over the years about old women and men bringing items to 'motel buys' and/or answering adds offering to sell "war trophies" and "bring-backs", while all long they have been set-up by some crook peddling fakes. Sometimes they know it is a scam, and other times I think they were not aware of being set-up by a crook.

[John Pic]

This one came out of N&T Global and is still out there someplace. I didn't own it.

[John Pic]

Here are two basic types of Sieder Eagles pay attention to the Bullion weave because the thread highlights are changed around on some to try and fool.

[John Pic]

Here are a couple with highlights added to fool.

[John Pic]

And one more for health

[RobertE]

Thanks John, that's an excellent account of the evolution of these replicas.

s/f Robert

[Robert H]

Ja the well known names...

A recent auction house offer has a lot of basic naked tunics offered, so many that I wonder where they all came out.

[Scott A. Hess]

They used to publish their items in a Militaria magazine with people wearing them to recreate scenes from WWII. There was an intercompany dispute and one person spilled the beans in a long letter describing how they created the uniforms, the letter leaked to the internet . They had a tailor and used insignias by Sieder company of Vienna. Johannes Floch sold many of these loose at Militaria shows around the World. I used to keep a copy of the letter but not anymore because the tunics are so numerous with Sieder insignia no proof is needed they are faked. A company on the East Coast that went out of business used to sell these exclusively as original N&T Global was their name. Ill attach some pictures of faked tunics with Sieder insignias. It would be nice if once discovered they were sold as Reproductions they aren't bad as fillers.

John, was all the insignia on these tunics fake, or just the eagles? We're the tunics themselves ground up fakes or real tunics? Was the wool period? The tunics themselves look really nice. If the insignia were real , were there tells that the tunics minus insignia were fake? Pretty scary items. From the pictures shown minus the insignia, the jackets would fool me, unless they in hand are just poorly done. I'd like to own an authentic SS officer tunic, but they scare the hell out of me

[John Pic]

The two at the top I feel were ground up fakes made with real gabardine but modern liner materials. They had real collar tabs and boards. The one after is also a ground up fake with fake tabs and boards all Sieder produced. The others well could've been real tunics rebadged with fake insignias. I've seen Seider eagle used to replace missing one on real SS tunics too.