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**90th Light** · 01-13-2014, 04:55 AM

Originally posted by viva_giulio View Post

not but is a part who gives an opinion, moreover when is bad stiched, as some fakes i seen.

Equally viva_giulio, there is "good stitched" on the original pre-May 1945 caps that the fakers have used to copy.

I do not see where this ambiguity about this cap is getting us except to plant the seed of discontent without any substance to explain why it is bad.

I agree that the bias material is unusual for one of these so there is a first point of focus. Beyond the repeated possibility of "good stitch" verses "bad stitch", what is the next point of focus ?

How do others feel about the bias material in this cap ?

Chris

**viva_giulio** · 01-13-2014, 07:13 AM

i mean how bias is stiched. Obvious it's only one thing i check... and if i find... i smile.
As always more traces for an opinion. For me.

here i would know if bias is stiched and fold as the image i prepared.

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Immagine.jpg (46.6 KB, 521 views)

**Honor** · 01-13-2014, 10:52 AM

so is it good or not if folded?

**sgstandard** · 01-13-2014, 01:55 PM

Cap

I defer to those with more expertise than me, concerning the originality of the cap itself. But the more I look at the insignia, the more I don't like it. The skull just isn't sewn like all the originals I've seen, including the other original examples posted, and ALSO, the trap posted today by "Canadian" on a different thread. With the exception of the jaw, bones, and teeth, the skull consists of machine-sewn, vertical lines. As for the insignia in question, the area under the skull's left eye deviates from the vertical lines, to angled lines. The machine is not set up to sew this way. The skull threads are too frayed, IMO. Period thread doesn't fray this much. I don't like the thread color - it should be more "silvery" looking. Another thing to look for, is how tight the stitching is on the eagle. On all the examples posted, the stitching on the eagle is so tight, it almost appears flush. Not so on this one. I don't like the eyes, the nose, or the way the jaw ends. The insignia could possibly be foreign manufacture, but I'm leaning more to it being fake.

**viva_giulio** · 01-13-2014, 06:19 PM

Originally posted by Honor View Post

so is it good or not if folded?

if not folded is another thing i don't like of this cap. i've seen also good cap without this reinforce by the way for me is akways a point to check.

**rzzzm** · 01-13-2014, 08:04 PM

It is folded ........thanks to all for opinion...best

Attached Files

**90th Light** · 01-13-2014, 08:24 PM

Originally posted by sgstandard View Post

I defer to those with more expertise than me, concerning the originality of the cap itself. But the more I look at the insignia, the more I don't like it. The skull just isn't sewn like all the originals I've seen, including the other original examples posted, and ALSO, the trap posted today by "Canadian" on a different thread. With the exception of the jaw, bones, and teeth, the skull consists of machine-sewn, vertical lines. As for the insignia in question, the area under the skull's left eye deviates from the vertical lines, to angled lines. The machine is not set up to sew this way. The skull threads are too frayed, IMO. Period thread doesn't fray this much. I don't like the thread color - it should be more "silvery" looking. Another thing to look for, is how tight the stitching is on the eagle. On all the examples posted, the stitching on the eagle is so tight, it almost appears flush. Not so on this one. I don't like the eyes, the nose, or the way the jaw ends. The insignia could possibly be foreign manufacture, but I'm leaning more to it being fake.

Hello sgstandard,

there is nothing wrong with the trap. I have posted a couple of 101% examples below for you to compare with. One panzer black backing, one field-grey backing. You will notice that also on these examples the horizontal black eye detail thread is 90 degrees from the vertical cream-white thread of the skull. There are three possible shades of thread used for the embroidery of the eagle & skull on this type of trap, 1/ cream-white 2/ silver-grey 3/ darker-grey.

I agree that the bias material is unusual. This is the first time that I think I have seen bias on this type of cap. the ones I have handled have not had bias material if my memory serves me correctly.

I am in a rush now but later when I get a chance, I will contact a couple of advance collectors who I know have this type of cap in their collections. I will get some detail shots and discuss some of the other issues that you raise when we are in a position to start comparing cap with cap,

Chris

Attached Files

**90th Light** · 01-13-2014, 08:32 PM

And the trap on the cap in question for comparision.

This is basically an identical trap when compared to the examples that I have shown in post number 37.

Note also the correct zig-zag stitch used to apply the trap to the cap,

Chris

Attached Files

pzIMG_0384.jpg (131.2 KB, 463 views)

**viva_giulio** · 01-13-2014, 09:54 PM

stiched on reverse side. just to point.

**SgtB** · 01-13-2014, 10:44 PM

Originally posted by Dr. Strangelove View Post

M43 Caps are tough, but I like this one!

I have to agree with the good Doctor on this one. And believe me, my opinion does not come from a position of naivete. I know full well that many (and well known) high-end fakers have been working around the clock for the past 30 years to fabricate the perfect SS M-43. My point is this one isn't perfect, but still smacks of an un-issued warehouse find. Of course, to be sure, I'd have to handle it and smell it and . . .

**90th Light** · 01-14-2014, 12:46 AM

Originally posted by viva_giulio View Post

stiched on reverse side. just to point.

Hello viva_giulio,

sorry but I do not understand what you are saying on this point

Chris

**90th Light** · 01-14-2014, 01:00 AM

Ok here are two different examples by this maker. These caps currently are sitting in advanced collections as 101% original with known history. I had the chance to have the two caps together one day so I took some side by side comparative photos.

On the viewers left is a cap made in 1945 made from Italian wool with no bias, no pull down tabs, dark green composite buttons and a trap with the eagle and skull done in cream-white thread embroidery.

On the viewers right is a cap made in 1944 made from German wool with no bias but does have pull down tabs, late war dark grey-green painted metal pebble buttons and a trap with the eagle and skull done in grey thread embroidery.

In the lower image the 1944 cap made from German wool is on top and the 1945 cap made from Italian wool is on the bottom,

Chris

Attached Files

**90th Light** · 01-14-2014, 01:06 AM

1944 made cap from German wool with grey embroidery trap is the top image

1945 made cap from Italian with cream-white embroidery trap is the lower image.

Note the zig-zag stitch used to apply the trap to the cap and the fraying edges of the traps,

Chris

Attached Files

**90th Light** · 01-14-2014, 01:12 AM

2

1944 made cap from German wool with grey embroidery trap is the top image

1945 made cap from Italian with cream-white embroidery trap is the lower image.

Note the zig-zag stitch used to apply the trap to the cap and the fraying edges of the traps,

Chris

Attached Files

**90th Light** · 01-14-2014, 01:15 AM

Top and inside of the 2 caps.

1945 cap made from Italian wool is on the viewers left and the 1944 cap made from German wool is on the viewers right.

The lining in the 1945 cap is made from ersatz cotton. The 1944 cap's lining is made from rayon/ artifical silk-satin

Chris

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