Originally posted by Gaspare
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Could be a keeper like the "Gau Munich" badge. -
Originally posted by der-hase-fee View Post
what are you talking about, wind your neck in.
Gaspare, no this is another ring. This ring is researched and also real cool but the one you are talking about the guy was LAH and fatally wounded in Northern France!Comment
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HR prices are big time atificial high.
In the EU they are more lower price rated, but pending where you look for a HR anyhow. I am not a big fan of HR anymore, a recent smaller auction house got a couple of HR and sold each in the 2-2.5k Euro range.Comment
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Had the hots for one a few yrs ago but because of the mess it became more about a Boyle certificate than the ring, indeed I felt having the paperwork was more important than the piece... what a mess, thats not the way collecting is supposed to be.
EricComment
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I have resisted posing on this thread until now as it is one of the oddest ones that I have ever seen from inception until present.
The best that I have been able to make of it is that some are saying that HRs are overpriced, artificially manipulated by a handful (or less) crooked dealers, over-hyped and near impossible to authenticate .......oh and also don't really have much significance as an important SS item.
The discredit or downplay of the these rings seems to take on an almost political like fervor with some and I have never been able to understand it. Anyone who has any real problem telling a real one from a fake....who has done his homework that is, should certainly stay far far away from SS Helmets, SS edged weapons (master fakes and bump ups there), SS cloth (hats, uniforms and all insignia) and really most any other German military items that retails for over $1000....in other words most everything these days except Hindenburg Crosses.
The presumption offered in this thread is that an SS HR can not really be worth anywhere near say $8000-$10,000 (much less $12,000+) but there is no problem with paying 20K plus for an SS DD helmet or SS tunic.
Instead some have suggested here that the real value of an SS HR should be closer to the going price of a SS officers sleeve eagle......with exceptional examples valued at about the price of a German Cross in gold.
To each his own.
Any problems that collectors have with these HRs is purely self-inflicted. When collectors establish a "gatekeeper" for any kind of item, this is what always results. Beware of the "go to" dealer to buy a type item from or to authenticate a type of item........more so when that is one person.
If you don't know it; don't buy it.
Second (and third and fourth) opinions are great and I encourage all to get them on anything.....but really when you need a certificate to prop up a real item that must represent itself......you are asking for trouble.Comment
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good post phild....
Any one paying "20K plus for an SS DD helmet" [
] will be as sorry as those who paid $10K for a 2nd pattern HR to a paperpusher...
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No, they will be twice as sorry.Originally posted by Gaspare View Postgood post phild....
Any one paying "20K plus for an SS DD helmet" [] will be as sorry as those who paid $10K for a 2nd pattern HR to a paperpusher... ,
If anyone thinks these rings are rare, think again. They're all over the place; they have been for years ,and they are increasing in number as you read this. If you cannot, or do not have the ability to verify the integrity of these "bad boys"..........................you will pay for your stupidity with your own sorrow.
What are they worth is the real purpose to this thread. I contend they are worth a whole lot less then they have been priced ,or are being priced in the current market. My suggestion is that the bottom will fall out of this artificially created price point, and that only the verified pieces will ever be worth anything. So what are you really purchasing with your money? If you are smart, you will purchase the truth, because you can always sell that back. It's all about the money with this item, unfortunately, I'm afraid. It will be years before these rings will see their real value because the "truth" has been altered by the unscrupulous in their attempt to create a market.Comment
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Regardless of what you say 11C, these rings are rare. They are made for one individual only. How rare is that!
You may find other rings, but they are to different people.
RonComment
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They are rare in the fact you can put your whole collection in your pocket when moving, thats it imo.
EricComment
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I agree and more so in that each HR is an individual unique item by merit of the fact that they are named and dated awards.....making them near unique in Third Reich items in that respect.Originally posted by tanker View Post
With over 16,000 official awards and some estimate that perhaps another 3-4000 unofficial awarded.....with no real back up stock on these as they were made to order, we can look at over 7000 RKs awarded with many suggesting that at least 1/2 again that number were produced......we have HRs at maybe 2X the number of RKs. It's anyone's guess as to which award had the highest survival rate from the war......but my educated would be that a higher % of RKs survived than did TK HRs for a number of reasons.
Take that for what you will, but even if you disagree with my position on the survival % you still have to admit that total numbers of HRs around are at best twice that of RKs.......so I can hardly see how anyone says that they are common.
I know from the last 10 years of attending many SOS and some MAX shows....and speaking with others at those shows that I missed....that typically the number of REAL HRs to be found at any give show (above) was in the ballpark of the number of RKs to be found at those same shows.....as those were always two items that I tracked.Comment
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Originally posted by phild View Post
Named and dated awards are not that unique in Third Reich items. I have a couple of named Luftwaffe Honor Goblets and a couple of SA daggers that were awarded with names and dates by the SA. RK award documents are the real "award" and they are all dated and named to individuals. If you want to talk about really RARE awards, perhaps we should be talking about 1944 Wound Badges or Blood Orders or German Orders. Common is a matter of opinion, and compared to those awards, honor rings will always be common. What makes them expensive is the mystique of the SS and not the number available at any time. Let's just wait and continue to watch the prices. My money is very much "bearish" on this award now.Comment
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And your point? You seemed to have missed the point in their rarity factor. Once again, they were only awarded to one specific individual and not awarded in a mass produced/generic award. If you think they are not rare or justified, then my suggestion is don't collect them. You seem to have arleady made up your mind about teh colelcting status and no matter what is written here, you won't change. With that, good luck in you other collecting endeavers. Ron
, jOriginally posted by 11C View PostComment
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My point is pretty obvious, as it was when I started this thread:Originally posted by tanker View Post
These rings are declining in value and have not reached a bottom yet due in part to artifically arrived price points created by certain dealers and their need to drive a market for personal gain. You can disagree, but the facts are still the same. You can justify these prices with any rationalization you choose or you can believe in your own "information" but the fact remains the same: They were overpriced, and now they are heading down in price as other TR items have already stabilized. IMO, they are not good investments yet, but perhaps they may be in the future. All I'm suggesting is that you watch the prices as they continue to drop, before you sink stupid money into this item.Comment
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You may be one of a soon to be extinct species of enthusiasts. It's all about the money, nothing else.Originally posted by Waven View Post
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