SS Honor Ring, possibly belonging to Dr Luwig Hahn?

[Dr. Strangelove]

a lot

That is a lot of Hahn.

[Hoss]

Matt
Good luck on the research I hope you can return the ring, you've been done mate.
Bad cast copy

Eric

[mclenrd]

What makes you say thats Eric? Seems to me you're a lot more clueless than i am. HAHAHA.

Matt
Good luck on the research I hope you can return the ring, you've been done mate.
Bad cast copy

Eric

[Hoss]

Ok
But forums aren't the only places these rings are discussed and I don't see a line of thumbs up here either.
One of my collector friends notice the lack of shirt. Lol!

[mclenrd]

Eric, with all due respect... do you have anything constructive to say? If not, then kindly keep it to yourself.

Meanwhile...
I've been flooded with emails.
I have one serious buyer with a serious offer but I have yet to hear back. You know who you are. The clock is ticking...
I have a few others interested but they seem to be dragging their feet.
step up...

Best,
Matt



ANYWAY...

more info... this is from Ross Kelbaugh of ssdolch.com concerning research.

Thanks for the inquiry and congrats on your 1944 TK ring. Sorry to report that you ring will be very difficult if not impossible to narrow down to only one "Hahn" as a recipient as there are so many with this name. Below is an essay I have written about the difficulties of identifying TK rings from the 1940s. Hope you find it useful:

I have been receiving a number of requests recently for researching 1940s dated Totenkopfrings. I have disappointed a number of collectors when I have been unable to identify with certainty their specific ring recipient. In numerous cases, research has identified several possible candidates, but no one individual who, in my judgement, has been beyond a reasonable doubt. But not all have the same standards as I do. Below are some of the problems I have encountered when doing this research.

Problems with 1940s Totenkopfring Research

First: Since you only have a last name to go by, there can be several people who share that surname. What may seem to be an odd name to you may be more common than you think.

Second: The Stammkarte (service/personal record card) used initially for all SS personnel and the Führerstammkarten (created early in 1938) just for SS Officers have a place to designate if a TK ring was awarded, but it can be inaccurate in failing to record when a ring was given in the 1940s. Even if they do indicate the award of a ring, these cards do not indicate the year a ring was given.

Third: The SS-Dienstalterslistes during the 1940s may indicate receipt of a ring and appear to be pretty accurate in that regards, but, unlike the 1930s, not all SS Officers are listed. This makes it impossible to follow many SS Officers from year to year to see when a ring was awarded if one had been received.

Fourth: It is very rare (but not impossible) to find any additional paper documentation for the award of a TK ring being made in the personnel file. This would give the date of the award, but would not eliminate the other possible qualifying ring recipients with the same last name for reasons stated above.

Fifth: This is the real wild card. In 1939, all SS men with membership numbers under 10,000, regardless of rank, became eligible to receive the Totenkopfring. How many were subsequently distributed to enlisted men and NCOs and how many have 1940s dates?

Here is an example of a notification of the award of a 1940s TK ring when I was researching a ring with the surname “Specht” dated 1944. It is great to find these in a file as they establish that the award was made and provide the specific date. Unfortunately they arerarely encountered in the files. In this case, there was another “Specht” whose Führerstammkarte also indicated award of the ring. He had become an SS officer in 1940 so could he have received a ring dated 1944? How prompt was the award based on three years of service as an SS officer? There were two others with the surname “Specht” who became officers in 1940 whose records do not indicate the award. Both were still active in 1944. Could one of these be the ring recipient? All of this adds up to the fact, in my opinion, that it is often very difficult to determine beyond a reasonable doubt the recipient of a Totenkopfring during the 1940s. If the identity of the ring recipient is important to you and you are in the market for a ring, I would advise that you do the research a head of time. And if the ring already has “research” with it, it may be advisable to have it double checked. This is one of he reasons I like numbered SS daggers.

Ok
But forums aren't the only places these rings are discussed and I don't see a line of thumbs up here either.
One of my collector friends notice the lack of shirt. Lol!

[juoneen]

Heres a question not often asked, so lets see if anyone can answer it, or if anyone really knows . Can , or will Body fluids after death, if exposed to a ring like this (made of silver) eat pitts into the ring like this one has.
I do know blood will at times stain silver, but it can be buffed off, but I am NOT aware if human blood will pitt silver like this one is pitted, as blood will do to steel when a person dies on top of a weapon, and the body is not disturbed for a few weeks or a month .

The body acid question is also relative to this ring, and... if so , it had to have been buried, but if not, then I would assume this was part of some nimrods ageing process, but without knowing if this type of pitting is at all possible to silver , I can't condemn it ..yet.

I do find it interesting that you state mr boyle would say something like, it looks like it might be original,when I would assume he would at most say something like, It may be promising,or has some good features , but cannot tell from photos only , and I would assume will always need to have it in hand prior to giving a complete and accurate opinion, as photo authentications just dont happen IMO. So when will you be sending this ring off??... soon??, or have you changed your mind after the comment to the negative????

[mclenrd]

There's a reason why thats not often if ever asked I'm sure. I'm not a forensic doctor. I don't see much "pitting" on the inside (very little) and if you were 68, I'm sue you'd be pitted as well. I do see scratches which seems consistent with other rings of this age. You can easily tell a fake and a real one right away. The pitting I do see on the outside is clearly on the back and backsides of the ring, the part that along the palm of your hand... over time wearing it will cause pitting. There is no pitting anywhere else on the ring.

I really don't have almost 300 bucks to throw around just so someone can give me a handwritten "yes". DB may be the expert but it seems silly. I want to but don't want to (and really can afford to).

The ring is genuine... I'm a collector willing to accept a price well below than any dealer would. If I get a COA, then the price WILL definitely go up. How many other authentic honor rings are for sale by another collector out there?

[Ultra Seven]

"You can easily tell a fake and a real one right away."

I used to think that too. I had some dealings with a reputable European antiques dealer. We _both_ thought the ring to be an original but we're unable to get a COA for it. Point is, they are some pretty good fake. Good enough that you can't readily tell from pictures.

-Sean

[mclenrd]

"You can easily tell a fake and a real one right away."

I used to think that too. I had some dealings with a reputable European antiques dealer. We _both_ thought the ring to be an original but we're unable to get a COA for it. Point is, they are some pretty good fake. Good enough that you can't readily tell from pictures.

-Sean

1. I'd NEVER buy something like this from Europe. Period.
2. It came from a Vets family... ie 'out of the woodwork'.... its real.

[Toronto_Matt]

I as a buyer would be suspicious of a seller not willing to spend $300 on a COA before he sold me a ring.

Having a COA would not only allow you to sell it for more but would also insulate you from anything nasty down the road if it did turn out to be fake.

[Capt. R]

I as a buyer would be suspicious of a seller not willing to spend $300 on a COA before he sold me a ring.

Having a COA would not only allow you to sell it for more but would also insulate you from anything nasty down the road if it did turn out to be fake.

Me too. I was suspicious when I heard about the "texted" photos.

[Ultra Seven]

1. I'd NEVER buy something like this from Europe. Period.
2. It came from a Vets family... ie 'out of the woodwork'.... its real.

I've had a good experience working with dealers in Europe. As long as they're open and willing to work with you there usually isn't a problem. As was the case with the questionable TK ring I was able to work with the dealer and achieve a satisfactory resolution. IMO the COA is well worth the price as it gives everyone involved in the transaction peace of mind.

-Sean

[Jon Fish]

1. I'd NEVER buy something like this from Europe. Period.
2. It came from a Vets family... ie 'out of the woodwork'.... its real.

Wooaaaaaahh whats wrong with Europeans mate!? Thats a bloody insult

[Hoss]

1. I'd NEVER buy something like this from Europe. Period.

People in Europe never buy something like this from the US...boom boom.

Eric

[Hoss]

Eric, with all due respect... do you have anything constructive to say? If not, then kindly keep it to yourself.

Not a problem Matt
Tell you what I'll level the playing field for you I've owned ONE yea, during the 60's bought for a few bucks equivalent dated '41 and looked nothing like this a struck not cast little shiny highly defined belter. I gave it to my girlfriend but the women I associate with now look nothing like the girlfriend I had back then either. So expert? no.

This cast buffed junk is all over forums and sold at shows quote> I would be interested, but the ring market has all but collapsed< unquote...that's ridiculous the bottom has only fallen out of fakes.

Also I misunderstood the saying 'Share your thoughts' didn't mean the ring itself and only wanted to help a fellow collector from making a purchase (in not only my view) error.

Eric