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**Death-Ace** · 12-02-2011, 09:09 PM

I can't remember right off but it has something to do with the mutiny in France during training. Wasn't it due to a Catholic starter that they, officers and Germans, feared that more reprisals may happen so they put them in a duty where possible trouble wouldn't happen: MP.Muslim troops, however, fought against the mutineers and many were honored so. I'll look it up once I get on the Dell and give you a link if no one else does elaborate first!

**NickG** · 12-02-2011, 09:09 PM

Period images SS-Feldgendarmerie Trupp 13 Handschar

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**NickG** · 12-02-2011, 09:11 PM

MP's patrolling on horseback.

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handscharhorse.jpg (58.4 KB, 774 views)

**NickG** · 12-02-2011, 09:13 PM

Uniform that I created (shown before) commemorating this unit.
Mostly original parts!

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**Death-Ace** · 12-02-2011, 09:19 PM

Nick, very nice! Which are original? The WB, tabs, etc? It looks great. Plan to do the same....but for repros with WaMu insignia for reenactments. Lol.

**NickG** · 12-02-2011, 09:24 PM

Originally posted by Death-Ace View Post

Nick, very nice! Which are original? The WB, tabs, etc? It looks great. Plan to do the same....but for repros with WaMu insignia for reenactments. Lol.

Thanks!
Salty original Heer pattern M42 (6 button) with modified M36 collar for that smart look an MP would want!
(the illustration is also a 6 button btw, partially modified by me)

Mine with repro rank straps and repro cuff. All other insignia = real.
Just an impression, wont' fool anybody that its been put together...still fun I think!

Original (stripped) fez with repro insignia added and repro gorget (on a budget!!)

OK Besslein fire away!

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IMG00002-20111202-1832.jpg (88.2 KB, 771 views)

**Death-Ace** · 12-02-2011, 09:31 PM

Originally posted by NickG View Post

Thanks!
Salty original Heer pattern M42 6 button (the illustration is also a 6 button btw, partially modified by me)
Mine with repro rank straps and repro cuff. All other insignia = real.
Just an impression, wont' fool anybody that its been put together...still fun I think!

I'd say so! Like a puzzle! Always have fun but that's something anyone'd wanna keep together.

Glad you have something to go by! Apparently the only photo of a Sani I've seen was of Georg Wikert (RIP) thanks to the responses on a thread. Doesn't help that he was wearing a smock!

Were all NCOs and Officers German?

From Wikipedia

Villefranche-de-Rouergue Mutiny (September 1943)

Tomb of the "Yugoslavian combatants" in Villefranche.
On 17 September 1943, whilst the Handschar was garrisoned in Villefranche-de-Rouergue in France, a group of communist infiltrators staged a mutiny within the Pioneer battalion. Led by Ferid Džanić, Eduard Matutinović, Božo Jelinek and Nikola Vukelić, they captured most of the German personnel and executed five German officers, failing to kill SS-Ostuf Michawetz, the pioneer battalion commander, who escaped. Apparently the mutineers believed that many of the enlisted men would join them and they could reach the western Allies. The revolt was put down with the assistance of the unit Imam, Halim Malkoć and Dr. Schweiger (unit physician). Imam Halim Malkoc told the Bosnian enlisted men of 1st Company that they were being deceived and rallied them to hunting down the instigators. Nevertheless, the mutiny did not spread as far as the exaggerated claims state. Approximately 20 of the rebels were killed summarily or after a trial. The Nazis were convinced that there were communists who had infiltrated the unit in order to disrupt it. Tito once suggested that his partisan followers enlist for police duty in Croatia where they could receive weapons, uniforms and superior training. Afterward there was a purge of members of the unit who were deemed "unsuitable for service" or "politically unsuitable". More than 800 were removed from the unit and sent to Nazi Germany for "labor service". It is likely that the bulk of these "unwilling" were Catholic Croats, because by the time the Division came back to Bosnia, only 300 Croats remained in the Division. Sauberzweig reorganized those 300 and sent them all to the Feldgendarmerie Trupp. Sauberzweig blamed the desertions on the Croats and units with Catholic Croat leadership and made it clear not to recruit any more or commission Croats. Of those, 265 who refused to work were sent to Neuengamme concentration camp where many of them died.
Himmler later on said of the mutiny: "I knew there was a chance that a few traitors might be smuggled into the division, but I haven’t the slightest doubt concerning the loyalty of the Bosnians. These troops were loyal to their supreme commander twenty years ago so why shouldn’t they be so today." Himmler was referring to the Bosnian Muslim troops who had served in the Austro-Hungarian Habsburg army. Himmler awarded the Imam Halim Malkoč an Iron Cross, Second Class, for his role in thwarting the mutiny. Bosnian Muslims Ejub Jašarević and Adem Okanadžić were also decorated by Himmler.
When the city was liberated in 1944, they decided to pay tribute to the troops by naming one of its streets Avenue des Croates (Slavic Muslims being identified as Croats of Islamic faith) and commemorating "the revolt of the Croats" every 17 September. After the war the Yugoslav government requested it be changed "the revolt of the Yugoslavs", it was refused by the French for "historical truth". The Villefranche-de-Rouergue mutiny is commemorated in the city with a monument designed by the Croatian sculptor Vanja Radauš.

**NickG** · 12-02-2011, 09:38 PM

Originally posted by Death-Ace View Post

It is likely that the bulk of these "unwilling" were Catholic Croats, because by the time the Division came back to Bosnia, only 300 Croats remained in the Division. Sauberzweig reorganized those 300 and sent them all to the Feldgendarmerie Trupp.

Interesting. So the Catholics were the least loyal of all Croat Handschar Freiwilligen, least dependable...
but than why put them in the MP unit of the Division I wonder? Wouldn't you want the most reliable troops to
be the police force for security sake? or more discipline is "handed out" in that unit to keep them in line?

**Death-Ace** · 12-02-2011, 10:05 PM

One would think! Maybe the mindset was different? Guess it depends where the were stationed, ect. Think they may have given them dangerous areas to serve to try and eliminate them? It seems they did with the "unwilling". Surely not all of them were not loyal. But were ALL of them reassigned?

**NickG** · 12-02-2011, 10:10 PM

Originally posted by Death-Ace View Post

Surely not all of them were not loyal. But were ALL of them reassigned?

Could question. Heck I did not even realize non-muslims were in Handschar!
(besides German and Reichs-Deutsche cadre of course)

**Death-Ace** · 12-02-2011, 10:27 PM

True! It seems like the Germans trusted Muslims more than Catholics (Even with a part of their country made up of us!). Seems like religion (except Judaism) didn't matter unless it caused something to begin turmoil. Though one general did say that they should start purging Catholic officers from the Heer...

Blue Skies of Thunderbolts,
Lev

**TrondK** · 12-03-2011, 02:46 AM

Interesting reading, i didnt know this.

**PBR** · 12-03-2011, 03:38 AM

Nick, you cannot discuss about this talking about "THE Catholic" or "THE Muslims".
The fact is that Tito's infiltrated partisans into Handschar in order to boycott it, and as we well know most of Tito's men were Catholic Croats and Serbians (very few Croat\Bosnian Muslims).
So, the Villefranche deserters were first "Communists\Partisans", or pushed by them: you can check Lepre on that.
The most of the Catholic Croats were generally liked by german troops, many of them were pretty hard-core while fighting Communism (see the Ustase for example), the NDH Croatian Army "Domobran" was for sure not fond of Communism (most of them were slaughtered just after the end of the war and left in the well know mass-graves) and thousands of Croats fought pretty well and fiercely to death in many well known german units (Prinz Eugen, Karstjaeger, 369 ID, 373 ID, 392 ID, Airforce and Naval legion, Deutsch-Kroatien Polizei units).

It's very likely that such 300 Catholics helped into crush the sedition at Villafranche, so they were considered pretty "tough" and still reliable and used for Feldgendarmerie duty.

BTW, one of the FG checking the woman documents is not a Croat for sure, since he is wearing the SS-Brustabazeichen on the pocket, so he must be a Reichsdeutscher.

**V.I.D.** · 12-03-2011, 04:29 AM

Originally posted by NickG View Post

Could question. Heck I did not even realize non-muslims were in Handschar!
(besides German and Reichs-Deutsche cadre of course)

Originally posted by Death-Ace View Post

True! It seems like the Germans trusted Muslims more than Catholics (Even with a part of their country made up of us!). Seems like religion (except Judaism) didn't matter unless it caused something to begin turmoil. Though one general did say that they should start purging Catholic officers from the Heer...

Blue Skies of Thunderbolts,
Lev

I am kind of surprised by your comments guys, especially you Nick, since I know you have a really good knowledge about this stuff and had shown interest in Handschar in the past as well.

Even Lepre's book tells a lot of about Croatian mutineers, but the big part of it is that you have to consider the ultimate situation in the area at the time. It is not that they were poor soldiers, it's just that they had different agenda from the majority of the unit's manpower. Many Muslims from proper Croatian (Ustasha) units went to Handschar, hence weakening the local forces to the German-led SS division. In addition, it is well known that Handschar was hoping for certain kind of Bosnian Muslim autonomy in the East-Northeast Bosnia. Sauberzweig even had a proclamation written to this end, it is also cited in Lepre's book in the full text, if I remember correctly. According to the same source, many nationalistic Handschar soldiers would rip off the Croatian checkerboard sleeve shield to demonstrate their sentiments toward the policies of NDH.

Finally, with the end of the war approaching Croatian government was doing quite a bit to sabotage further strengthening of the SS division built nearly entirely of what they considered to be Croatian Muslims - but of quite different loyalties altogether. Perhaps a bit of understandable jealousy was also involved on their part, with the Bosnian Muslims receiving brand new German "toys". Ultimately it didn't matter in the end, since even Bosnian Muslims became unhappy about having to leave their homeland for Hungary, hence the increase in desertion rates in autumn of 1944.

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Catholic troops in Handschar's MP unit?

Catholic troops in Handschar's MP unit?

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