HELP pls with: W-SS EM coat !

[markus]

Dear friends,

As some might know, I am a passionate LAH document collector, but a total loser when it comes to cloth....

Hence I would appreciate your opinions on the below shown Waffen-SS Ari EM M43 coat in order to avoid pricey mistakes.

E.g. Is there a way to really know whether this coat is W-SS and not WH convered by sewing on a BeVo sleeve eagle?

[markus]

W-SS Mannschaftsmantel 1943

Rear views

[markus]

W-SS Mannschaftsmantel 1943

BeVo Ärmeladler

[markus]

W-SS Mannschaftsmantel 1943

Inside...

[markus]

W-SS Mannschaftsmantel 1943

Markings...

[markus]

W-SS Mannschaftsmantel 1943

Last, not least the Ari shoulderstraps. These appear to have been added to the coat at a later stage, which is o.k. I guess.

[David48]

Markus,
According to Volume 6 Uniforms of the SS by Andrew Mollo pages 28 and 29: after 1941 the issue field grey great coat was identical to the army pattern, at first with dark green collar and later with field grey. Hope this helps.

[markus]

Many thanks David. This infoirmation is in line with several other reference
books I have.

From that perspective, the coat would be in line.

Still the question bugs me, whether this could be an Army piece with an
attached armeagle, only at x-times the price of a reg. WH coat.

Can anyone comment on the stamps/markings?

[Johnny R]

Hola Markus-

I would wait for a better example without questions.

[markus]

Hola Markus-

I would wait for a better example without questions.

Buenos dias Johnny!

I agree, but what makes this one questionable?

The fact that I was asking doesn't make it questionable, or are there
certain facts that speak against it?

I've seen the coat 1-2 times in Helmut's shop and the arm eagle
e.g. just feels that it's been there forever. (Doesn't mean anything
of course.)

[Johnny R]

I personally would buy one that is text book if you want an "SS" coat. Just my opinion. Is there a good sized hole in the skirt or is that the photo?

[markus]

Thanks Johnny! I totally agree, but what makes this one non-textbook,
if I make naively ask?

My reference books incl. Beaver show all sorts of models and find
that rather confusing.

What makes a 1943 text-book piece?

Thanks!

[Johnny R]

Thanks Johnny! I totally agree, but what makes this one non-textbook,
if I make naively ask?

My reference books incl. Beaver show all sorts of models and find
that rather confusing.

What makes a 1943 text-book piece?

Thanks!

Only people who assert they know everything about this stuff are naïve- For a solid late War coat I would want one in the blue gray cloth without french cuffs etc. and HBT lining like the one shown in volume two page 505-509. If you are going to have one example something like that coat would be a good piece etc.

[markus]

Johnny,


I will double check the Beaver ref tonight when home.
I wouldn't say 1943 is late war though, rather mid-war, no?

Would an Army coat not bear different markings? An RBN Nr. eg?
And this is an SS contractor piece?

It's just crazy how difficult SS cloth can be!

[markus]

According to Helmut Weitze himself, the coat has a different cut with the sleeve pleats (Aufschläge/Cuffs) and Riegel (closing devise on the back), in comparision to a "normal" WH model.

QUOTE
Der Mantel der Waffen-SS hat einen etwas anderen Schnitt, hinten beim Riegel und bei den Ärmelaufschlägen. Außerdem hat er innen eine typische Kammerstempelung " 479/43" eines RZM-Betriebes, der für die SS gefertigt hat.
UNQUOTE

The marking "479/43" is a typical stamp for an RZM factory producing for the SS.



Can anyone comment on that?