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**JoeW** · 08-05-2009, 04:24 PM

Originally posted by DR DOLCH View Post

I am a historian and like to see things in the right light. I am trying to figure out if there is anyway to find out who a ring belonged too without the award document. I do not think there is. Albert is listed in the 1937 SS SERVICE LIST he is shown promoted to untersturmfurher on 4/20/37 yet he does not have the ring.If they have time to put his promotion date in the 1937 I would guess the ring would also be listed. The promotion date is not always or may be not at all related to the ring date. Someone with the KEY and the 1936 SS Service list needs to look up Adam(3826),Albert(13956),Bendix,(11001)Kurt (266616)Adler and see who had the ring in 1936 which would eliminate the 1937 dated ring as being theirs.You might as well send the ring to Don Boyle for the final word on originality.

Using my copies of the 1936 and 1937 SS-DALs, we find that Albert Adler was not an officer listed on the 1936 DAL and had not received the TK ring according to the 1937 DAL.

Adam Adler was listed in both the 1936 and 1937 DAlL, but had not received the TK Ring.

Kurt Adler was listed in both the 1936 and 1937 DALs as possessing the TK Ring, so he is eliminated as Adler of this ring.

Bendix Adler, SS #11001, dob 7.6.11, is listed as not having received the TK Ring in the 1936 DAL, but possessing the ring in the 1937 DAL. The 1937 DAL was published December 1, 1937. I would surmise, the Alder on the ring refers to this member of the 4.Sta. and NSDAP member 282 732. He is listed in the '37 DAL as Untersturmfuhrer as of 13.9.36.

You're welcome.

**Schmeisserfan** · 08-05-2009, 04:42 PM

Originally posted by JoeW View Post

Using my copies of the 1936 and 1937 SS-DALs, we find that Albert Adler was not an officer listed on the 1936 DAL and had not received the TK ring according to the 1937 DAL.

Adam Adler was listed in both the 1936 and 1937 DAlL, but had not received the TK Ring.

Kurt Adler was listed in both the 1936 and 1937 DALs as possessing the TK Ring, so he is eliminated as Adler of this ring.

Bendix Adler, SS #11001, dob 7.6.11, is listed as not having received the TK Ring in the 1936 DAL, but possessing the ring in the 1937 DAL. The 1937 DAL was published December 1, 1937. I would surmise, the Alder on the ring refers to this member of the 4.Sta. and NSDAP member 282 732. He is listed in the '37 DAL as Untersturmfuhrer as of 13.9.36.

You're welcome.

Joe,
this would be really awesome if Bendix is the right man . Thank you very much for your effort

Perhaps I can find more about it through the Internet .
Cheers from your namesake ,
joe

**Military** · 08-05-2009, 05:27 PM

This is a very interesting thread and i'd like to see how you get on Schmeisserfan. Again our advice would be to send to Don.

**sgstandard** · 08-05-2009, 07:52 PM

Ring

YES- Let us know what Don says. The history of the recipient is worthless if the ring is not authentic.

**Military** · 08-05-2009, 08:09 PM

Im leaning towards a bad copy.

**Schmeisserfan** · 08-06-2009, 05:19 AM

hey,
the main problem for the moment is that I don´t want to send the ring to the USA or to Canada ( where is Don exactly located ? ) . Its not because I´m afraid to lost it or something ... but the main problem is our customer service when the item will be send back .
As you know, many collectors in Germany got in trouble because of importing items of the 33-45 area , not important for the guys if copy or even original

. Items with swastika are illegal to import for us ... there are differences if the thing is original of course ... but the way to attest this is not the easiest .
I myself don´t want to have this risk or any other trouble .. as you surely understand

**Military** · 08-06-2009, 05:21 AM

Don is based in the States.

**Schmeisserfan** · 08-06-2009, 05:22 AM

If anyone know another guy and experienced man for ww2 rings who can help with the "hand inspection" and is possible located in Europe .. this would be a useful help !

**Schmeisserfan** · 08-06-2009, 05:26 AM

Originally posted by Military View Post

Don is based in the States.

hmm ok ... I will add some more pictures and better ones during the weekend .. perhaps something will get clearer then or a collector will see a red flag

**JoeW** · 08-06-2009, 09:04 AM

Joe, was the ring sold to you as belonging to Albert Adler with you paying additional monies for the research and photographs? Then you should seek a refund as the documentation research seems woefully incomplete to be able to produce the personal information associated with the ring. As Robin pointed out, a simple view of the 1937 SS DAL would show that it could not be his. This lack of work on the part of the seller, would seem to indicate more of a desire to sell a ring with a fancy supposed owner than to correct identify the name. I would worry about that.

**DR DOLCH** · 08-06-2009, 09:20 AM

So....... is it a fact that the year that is on the ring is always in the same year as the ring 1st appears in the SS service list i.e 1937 ring date ring is in the 1937 SS list 1938 ring 1st appears in 1938 list ect. Or is it just another detail we surmise. I would like owners of rings to join in.

**kumatrax** · 08-06-2009, 10:05 AM

Originally posted by Schmeisserfan View Post

hey,
the main problem for the moment is that I don´t want to send the ring to the USA or to Canada ( where is Don exactly located ? ) . Its not because I´m afraid to lost it or something ... but the main problem is our customer service when the item will be send back .
As you know, many collectors in Germany got in trouble because of importing items of the 33-45 area , not important for the guys if copy or even original

. Items with swastika are illegal to import for us ... there are differences if the thing is original of course ... but the way to attest this is not the easiest .
I myself don´t want to have this risk or any other trouble .. as you surely understand

Hi, this is very true and I understand your concern. I have similar troubles in Japan with my particular aspect of collecting. What I have learned is never to say exactly what is in the package, and give it an almost worthless value, but with a tracking number.
It is a bit risky, but the post connections between Germany and the USA are very fast and reliable. For me, I would rather deal with a bit of mail stress than have endless worry about my SSTK ring.
In this hobby, there always seem to be many deals with the devil.

**Schmeisserfan** · 08-06-2009, 10:13 AM

Originally posted by JoeW View Post

Joe, was the ring sold to you as belonging to Albert Adler with you paying additional monies for the research and photographs? Then you should seek a refund as the documentation research seems woefully incomplete to be able to produce the personal information associated with the ring. As Robin pointed out, a simple view of the 1937 SS DAL would show that it could not be his. This lack of work on the part of the seller, would seem to indicate more of a desire to sell a ring with a fancy supposed owner than to correct identify the name. I would worry about that.

hey,
I bought the ring and the the 3 photos + the copy of the DAL page where Albert Adler was named . So of course, I really thought as trustful collector, this should be right .
I myself think that the previous owner bought it from the dealer ( Niemann ) ,had a look in the DAL and then made the mistake about "Albert " . According to the 3 photos , they were added perhaps to make a good show and perhaps this man is someone completly different than Adler.
But I will find out if I can get contact to him the next days

**Schmeisserfan** · 08-06-2009, 10:18 AM

Originally posted by kumatrax View Post

Hi, this is very true and I understand your concern. I have similar troubles in Japan with my particular aspect of collecting. What I have learned is never to say exactly what is in the package, and give it an almost worthless value, but with a tracking number.
It is a bit risky, but the post connections between Germany and the USA are very fast and reliable. For me, I would rather deal with a bit of mail stress than have endless worry about my SSTK ring.
In this hobby, there always seems to be many deals with the devil.

Hehe yes, but even if you write a wrong content on the parcel and a different value ... in Germany they open the parcels from outside EU regularly
and then you are in trouble double.
Unfortunately, this is the common situation here .. and I will not risk to be threated as a nazi nor I don´t want to justify myself
as a collector with historic interest

**Thorsten B.** · 08-06-2009, 10:28 AM

"Items with swastika are illegal to import for us..."

Who told you such complete nonsense??

Apart from the fact that most custom officers here are not really related to NS-stuff - and as a result have a lack of knowledge for sure - there is no law that forbids importing any NS-stuff here into Germany.

Why is it that german collectors are afraid of anything in that direction?

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