Waffen-SS Einheits. M43 EM

[Bob Hritz]

Tony,

Mine has a tan colored cotton lining.

Bob Hritz

[TONY Q.W.]

Tony,

Mine has a tan colored cotton lining.

Bob Hritz

Thanks Bob, I quess they probably used whatever was available then.

[j dubbel]

white piping is for officers in the wehrmacht whitch means officier in the infantrie der wehrmacht

metal silver wire is for waffen ss officers

sorry for my bad english

Yes, unless I'm totaly wrong (NOT FOR THE FIRST TIME!) white piping on an M43 would be for SS only, not Heer.

[billbert]

Hello Wehrmachtsman
I believe they are talking ONLY in reference to piping on SS m43 and overseas caps.. NOT piped white piped HEER army dress visor caps which indeed you are correct and there is no silver piping on army officer dress visor caps other than the chincord..Hope this helps!!Billbert

[ReichsHeini]

white piping is for officers in the wehrmacht whitch means officier in the infantrie der wehrmacht

But it was also used by the WSS for M-43 caps for officers below the rank of Standartenfuherer

[90th Light]

But it was also used by the WSS for M-43 caps for officers below the rank of Standartenfuherer

Does this hold true for Waffen SS officers M43 caps ? because in my experience it has been easier to find ones with silver piping rather than white piping not that originals of either of them are easy to find.

You would think however that silver piped ones would be very hard to find given that in theory they represent Standartenfuherer and above in rank but go and try and find a white piped one and you will see what I mean.

Would be interested in the experience of others regarding this,

Chris

[TonyS]

Does this hold true for Waffen SS officers M43 caps ? because in my experience it has been easier to find ones with silver piping rather than white piping not that originals of either of them are easy to find.

You would think however that silver piped ones would be very hard to find given that in theory they represent Standartenfuherer and above in rank but go and try and find a white piped one and you will see what I mean.

Would be interested in the experience of others regarding this,

Chris

My experience also is that silver piping is more common.

[sgstandard]

M-43 Cap

I think Bob's point that is lost in this discussion is, SURE, some RB numbered SS M-43's may be original, but considering the investment involved, why buy something that goes against what is generally seen? It seems that there would ALWAYS be lingering doubts in the mind of the buyer.

[wolf76]

This is my M43 with a RBN number and trapazoid

Edward

[wolf76]

.

[wolf76]

..

[90th Light]

I think Bob's point that is lost in this discussion is, SURE, some RB numbered SS M-43's may be original, but considering the investment involved, why buy something that goes against what is generally seen? It seems that there would ALWAYS be lingering doubts in the mind of the buyer.

To my way of thinking it is important not to be lost in how sexy something looks or the rate of return on investment but to stand there and think I am holding a real piece of history. Something that was there at that time. Oh what it saw if it could talk ? but then could we really handle hearing the details in some cases.

Now if a cap which really was worn by the SS during WW2 has an RB number or an RF number then should I not buy it because of that ??? Should I just throw it in the rubbish bin and say nice figure but shame about the face ???

Personally I do not own an SS M43 with an RB or RF number which I can say beyond doubt that I got from a veteran or other respected source and that this is a known original.

What I have in my collection is a cap with the number "64/ XXXX/ XXXX" which I know to be correct in every respect. The interesting points about the makers code in this cap is that it starts with "64" and no one can fully explain that also it has no "RB" or "RF" prefix. Now I think I struck a note with Bob Hritz and some others when I suggested that the codes without RB or RF could indicate manufacture in an SS production facility not controlled by the RB or RF authorities who seem to have produced predominantly for the Wehrmacht. We then wondered if an RB or RF prefix in an SS M43 cap showed manufacture by a Wehrmacht maker to meet SS demands.

Some of the advanced collectors contributing to this thread such as Bob Hritz said that they had never had such a cap themselves from a veteran or a "motel buy" and did not feel comfortable with such a cap viewing many as possible post war put togethers or fakes. Now I think this is a shame and like the kiss of death for such caps which if they did exist then becomes a crime against history.

Since this thread started I have been trying to collect evidence of examples of SS items with RB or RF numbers. The going has been slow but not because they don't not exist but because I am limited in the time or access I have to view such items. I do persevere however. Several members also have emailed me or PM me to say that they have an SS cap with RB or RF or something else SS with such a number. I will now ask some of them if I can mention their names or even better they may post images of their item.

I am pleased to see this thread come up again it is unfinished business and I look forward now to some more debate. We may even come to a conclusion.

Regards, Chris

PS wolf76, looks like a nice cap to my eye from those images, single button too which is a bonus. Thanks for posting. Every one of these we can see is a help and more evidence.

[90th Light]

In light of the current discussion going on at the moment about RB numbers in SS M43 caps, it might be timely to bring this thread to the top again,

Chris

[wisches]

This is my M43 with a RBN number and trapazoid

Edward

I could be wrong on this one but the embroidered trap is not one i recognise as correct!!! please someone correct me as being a known original and i'd be happy to save it to my 'good' insignia file
thanks
wisches

[nutmeg]

There seem to be two threads ongoing on this topic , I posted these pictures on the other but no one seems to be following that thread. Here is one that is a DIRECT buy by me from the USAAF vet with an Rb number. I have noticed on the other thread that two other caps with Rb numbers have the eagle sewn on in a simpler manner then the usual way. I don't think rb numbered SS soft caps are very common, but there is no doubt in my mind they are fine.

I buy mostly from vet estates so have a somewhat different perspective on things then those who buy mostly from dealers or other collectors. This same vet had a nice long strip of SS green traps many of you bought when I sold them on estand .