Waffen-SS Einheits. M43 EM

[billbert]

Bob Hritz
Thanks for expounding your view and opinion..When you get a chance you might want to shoot some fotos of your size marked only army m43 s...Dont think if seen many ORIGINAL ones that way..Plenty of fake ones have arrived that way in the last decade or so..Thanks!!Billbert

[Bob Hritz]

Heer cap devoid of interior marking.

[Bob Hritz]

Profile

[Bob Hritz]

Blank interior

[Bob Hritz]

Insignia

[Bob Hritz]

Reinforcing rayon from turnup, from end to end.

Bob Hritz

[Bob Hritz]

Sorry for the last 2 poor photos, but did not use the flash to wash out details.

I am no hat expert, but this one is from my ads, are all my heer hats. I never collected Heer caps or tunics, but accumulated a few from my years of advertising. Jim Pool has seen my heer stuff, perhaps he can comment.

Bob Hritz

[Tommaso]

Bob,

sorry to ask you again, but since you back on the theme, what do you think about the German Militaria's M43 whose link have been posted by Francesco?

Thanks
T

[90th Light]

Thank you to all who have responded since my posting.

I have the up-most respect for Bob Hritz experience and observations. What I take out of what he is saying, is that he and several other advanced collectors who he knows have not had an un-questionable SS M43 with an RB number. This tells me that such an SS M43 cap could be rare but not impossible. It makes sense that the majority of SS M43's would have come from SS manufactured sources.

As a result of this thread, I was talking to a good friend and fellow collector today. He said that he had an unquestionable SS M43 with an RB number stamped in it.
I told him that I also have one but my number does not start with "RB" mine is just a number in the usual format of "X/ XXXX/ XXXX".

Now this is where it gets interesting, the first digit in my friends SS RB numbered M43 is not a zero but a number. The first digit in my SS M43 is also a number and not a zero. I have been told that when an RB number begins with zero then that means made in Germany. When the RB number begins with a number then that means made in another country of the Third Reich. For examples-sake and this is a made up example to explain my point,

0 = Germany
1 = Poland
2 = France
3 = Austria
etc, etc

I have no evidence to support this, I am just raising the question but to date it is a question which has not yet been answered.

In addition, we also have the mystery of an "RB" number verses an "RF" number. Now what is the meaning of that ? This raises three questions

1/ Why are many M43 caps both SS, WH, LW, & KM only marked with a size marking only ?

2/ Why do a few have an "RF" number ?

3/ Why do some have only a number in the format of "X/ XXXX/ XXXX" ?

Now Bob Hritz may have hit on the answer to question 3 ? This might be the SS version of the RB number system. Because of their ownership of the factory the "RB" part does not apply. Where as something made outside of the SS owned manufacturing system is designated "RB" or "RF" If it is made in Germany the number starts with "0" if it is made in another part of the Reich then it starts with "1" or "5" or "9" may be even "25", who knows ?

What all this is telling me, is I need to do more research and will now pay greater attention to "RB" numbers or lack there of.

I still maintain however that it is quite logical to have a factory made SS M43 cap with an RB number esp. if it is dated 1944 or 1945 because in 1944 Nazi Germany finally became a fully committed war time economy. They had pulled out all the stops and reached the edge of their "Production Possibility Curve" even attaining a level of economic growth despite the intensive and ever increasing bombing. The fact was that in 1944 some SS factories had ceased to exist but the caps still had to be obtained by any means viable.

Hope I have not lost you all on this one and I have not put down the exact RB numbers in our SS M43 caps because I do not want to give the fakers any more information than they already have.

With best regards, Chris

[jimt]

m 43

Nice work Chris........ makes sense
jim toncar

[billbert]

Thanks for the fotos Bob..have you ever had it in bright sunlight to see if maybe poorly inked markings washed out??Billbert

[djpool]

Sorry for the last 2 poor photos, but did not use the flash to wash out details.

I am no hat expert, but this one is from my ads, are all my heer hats. I never collected Heer caps or tunics, but accumulated a few from my years of advertising. Jim Pool has seen my heer stuff, perhaps he can comment.

Bob Hritz

That M43 is a no brainer original IMHO. No markings are visible from what I remember. If Bob reminds me we can pull it out on Thursday and look at it again.Its possible the markings are just faded out.Jim

[Bob Hritz]

Bilbert,

no washed out markings, in the M-43 cal.

Chris,

You may have something with the non RB prefix, but a similar numbering system. It would make sense for a uniform type of code for reporting the durability, and making recommendations for changes or improvements. I will check my SS camo M-44 tunics.

Bob Hritz

[Luca Ongaro]

If RB numbers exsist in the SS M-44 camo jackets and pants ( Have seen sets directly from vets) then why cannot these numbers be found in hats? makes no sense to me ? I think they are the real deal.........
jim toncar

I am agree with you Jim, I have a pair of camo pants with RB numbers and these are authentic for sure, trust me.
Bob, as you told and in my poor experience I never seen this stamp in SS EM M43 caps, I have four of it I retain authentic and no one has RB numbers otherwise part of WH caps I own have it.
One think is sure if relly existed are undoubtedly rare.
Just my two cents, interesting thread
Luca

[Luca Ongaro]

Here close up of RB numbers