Waffen-SS Einheits. M43 EM

[besslein]

cap is ok,the insignia are good too,I hope only that the are original since 1945 on this cap.
The cap itself look for me like wh cap.

[viva_giulio]

Recently i have sawn in my hand 2 very good m43 caps built with original wool isn't this case but all must be with open eyes.
For this example... i don't like (from photo) the total absence of patina and aging. Inside materials are ok... what's about the interior rinforcement? Also as Singer insigna don't appear as original stiched... it's not a great problem... but... as singer said, a WH m43 become an wss m43
In m43 cap i would buy only a used with heavy patina item... it's too much a minefield! IMO

[Tommaso]

here we are

[Tommaso]

more

[Tommaso]

two more

[BenVK]

If I had to bet on it, I'd say that stitching was not done 60+ years ago.

[Tommaso]

last

[Francesco]

Personally I have no problem with this one.
Cap looks good from these photos and in my monitor looks not a too used M43 but with a nice patina.
Insignia is fine but impossible to say if WW2 applied.

Francesco

[Tommaso]

Thanks Francesco.

I would like somebody to explain me what's wrong with this cap, if anything.

Thanks
Tom

[pete]

.

I wish i could comment more but i just dont have enough hands on yet with many of these in hand. It looks ok to me so far But i am begining to see that these M43 caps really are a minefield. Personally Im not going to take another unless I know where its coming from and its history. I have been in this boat before.

I had a beautiful looking Betra ra marked cap in italian wool and HBT lining which some people liked and some didnt but it was real nice looking and felt good to me and apparently out of an old collection. It didnt match a newer well done fake that it was "only similair" to but it made it iffy for me enough to get rid of it just because of the markings. For example Betra ra mainly produced tunic and fur so i gather, and these caps were mainly a contract item. The cap might have been fine but the stamps freaked others of a greater level of experience out so it freaked me out too. So, RBN numbers on an ss cap are not always a problem, one thing i learned from other collectors who know their history. Its common knowledge fakes are being put together and aged by calculated people who read this forum to deceive others from original or WH caps as we all know well so if it has the right period features but you cant tell with the insignia it goes for most of this ss uniform stuff, are you happy with a possibly restored (most probably restored) but original "parts" item. In the end in my case there were not a "great amount" of people who were alot more knowledgeable then me who really entertained me, sucks when youve already spent a big amount of money with a pure heart and hoping for the best based on what you know, no body knows who you are and you genuinly want to know an answer for yourself, not to make more fakes. One of the best peices of knowledge ive learned here from people more knowledgable whove been at this a while is to know your history and be ready to accept that not everything, and alot of it is far from textbook as alot of photos also show and what we have seen to be a known good accepted example.

On the other hand as a reputable dealer told me recently youll always have an itch while it sits in your closet that will bother you if youre going for the all original untouched cap. You could always remove parts of the eagle-skull and look for shading but then youd have to buy it first and also ruin a cap and carry out other tests.

If I ever win a trillion dollars I will make a project to purchase, study and rip apart high end fakes, and the first persons id involve would be a few people around here to carry it out and track their sources down!

[Tommaso]

Thanks Pete for your comment.
Cheers
Tom

[Bob Hritz]

The RB number, on a cap with SS insignia, would be enough for me to walk away.

Bob Hritz

[Panzer Rob]

One could easily entertain doubts about the insignia being applied pre-07.May 1945 and that is definitely a "liability" should you ever decide to sell it down the road. Both the cap and insignia look original from the pictures, but there's really not much you can do to prove exactly when the insignia was added. Judging from what I can see, my feeling is that it was added post-war. I don't like owning pieces that keep me up at night, and this one would gnaw away at me. It could be period, it could be put together. Only you can determine whether or not you are comfortable with keeping it.

I personally would pass unless the price was right.

Rob

[Tommaso]

Thanks guys.

Cheers
Tom

[besslein]

The RB number, on a cap with SS insignia, would be enough for me to walk away.

Bob Hritz

you are right Bob ,I have never seen original Waffen SS m43 cap with rb number