Yet another SS kepi

[derek]

I agree that the overall look of this kepi is pretty good. As a word of caution to a prospective buyer, if I were inspecting this hat up close I would be checking for signs of a reworked SA kepi.
Derek

[Gary Wood]

Here are a couple more Kepi shots

[Gary Wood]

another

[derek]

Gary,
Thanks for the pictures. Your shots nicely illustrate the fact that SS kepis were worn with and without the black button on the front. The very first early ones, 1920's to 1932, were frequently made with lacquered leather peaks.
Derek

[Robin Lumsden]

Another kepi shot......and a cufflink!

[Robin Lumsden]

If you look at these and other kepi pictures, there are hardly 2 the same. Some have buttons at the front, some don't. Some have standard chinstraps, some have straps with holes. The scallops are all different shapes. Some have 2 air vents, others have 1. And so on.

If they're all so different on the outside, heavens knows what differences they had on the inside.

I don't think we can be too dogmatic about what constitutes a 'right' and a 'wrong' kepi.

As best as I can tell, these things were made in many different qualities by many different manufacturers, some of which were small 'cottage-type' operations.

SS men at that time had to buy their own gear, so he who paid most got a better outfit than his pals.

A bit like the old Kaiserzeit officers who tried to outdo each other with the size of their pickelhaube spikes.

[Robin Lumsden]

Here's another....

[Donald Abenheim]

sicher ja

All the above is very valid. Thanks also for the wealth of images. The only source of doubt I have as concerns this Richter cap is thus : I recall various well made fake NSDAP Schirmmuetzen (Reichsleitung und Gauleitung) with the RZM Zulassungsnummer rendered under the rhombus. The GDC site was filled with these caps in the era 2001-2002. Also, I would be happier with this cap before us were an RZM tag present that accorded with the rest of the cap, that is, fit the time period (whatever that is...), more or less. Of course, these tags are also faked fairly well, but the fake tags betray flaws that make an analysis of echtheit easier. An authentic tag in the right context is an important criterion. I owned an SA cap from Kupper with the correct white tag with brown Schrift. The Kupper cap had the logo of the era (1934? 1935?) , as well as the right RZM tag. The cap was worn, and wholly real. It ended up in the great Coleman collection. But this fetid woolen was from the era when regalia had the logos and the RZM tags, before Hitler banned logos from such regalia and only the tag later carried the maker's identity (as of March 1935...) To put it another way, colleague Hassler posted two of his nice caps in another file, one of which is a C Wagner from about 1938/9. If such a cap also had a Clemens Wagner logo, I would be suspicious of the thing. If the cap were of earlier make, say 1933 or 1934/5, then such a thing would distress me less.
By the way, how can sane people familiarize themselves with such niggling, miniscule little facts about the 20th century? Is anyone alive today that knew any of this in 1934 in an official capacity?

This being said, this kepi (Richter/Dresden) at hand does actually look more like a real Shaftmuetze than do many hereabouts , with the rigid structure (steife Ausfuehrung...) &c. I greatly respect the views of my colleagues and thank them for their interventions.


Colleague Lumsden's point about the variety of these things is very germane and quite wise. However, the presence of the RZM nomenclature in this piece indicates somewhat later make than earlier, I think. But all of this reflection is idle without actually looking at the thing in person.

[derek]

I don't disagree with Robin's point that early uniform pieces were quite varied. But there is a very relevant point that Donald has brought up that one should take into consideration. This isn't a particularly early hat. The presence of an RZM code number and a celluloid diamond would suggest to me that the interior of this hat is from a later date when SS items were reasonably uniform. All the early hats I have seen from 1933 and 1934 have interiors quite different from this.
Having said that I must stress that I have never seen this cap so I am offering no opinions as to its authenticity, I just think it's worthwhile to assess these rare items with a reasonable scepticism.
Robin, with regards to SS hats I have always approached them with the opposite of your professional mandate: "Guilty until proven innocent".
Derek

[Robin Lumsden]

Robin, with regards to SS hats I have always approached them with the opposite of your professional mandate: "Guilty until proven innocent".
Derek

Derek.

That IS my professional mandate!

[derek]

I'm glad to see those historic ties between Scotland and France are still alive and well and that Napoleonic law still prevails in your bailliewick.
Derek

[Robin Lumsden]

I'm glad to see those historic ties between Scotland and France are still alive and well and that Napoleonic law still prevails in your bailliewick.
Derek

Amen to that!

[drew Allman]

.

Thanks for all the help and information. I will soon have it in my hands and will take more pictures of it then.

[drew Allman]

pictures

Well I finally received it in the mail so here are pictures of the inside and buttons.
Thanks!


The buttons on the otherside are equally corroted looking...

[drew Allman]

.

.