compare 4
now put this one next to the one in the book and seeck the difference(s) between textbook and this....
now put this one next to the one in the book and seeck the difference(s) between textbook and this....
-
Interested in all E. Reitz Uniformwerke items. -
conclusion
The conclusion IN MY OPINION the smock does not confirm with known wartime examples, due to the flaws in the pattern itselfs. No other material in this camo pattern - WH splinter( zelts, smocks, parka's....) show these flaws.
Given the German "grundlichkeit" such flaws would not have been accepted ( note: this is MY assumption, not a given fact !). Printing flaws ( e.g. white lines etc. WERE accepted and are often encountered. Mistakes in the pattern itself, means that the dye rolls were wrong.. I doubt if this were to be accepted. ( again MY assumption)
So Andy, I hate to say this....really I whish it were different.
I only hope some of the unscrupulous copiesellers can be hurt too.
WernerInterested in all E. Reitz Uniformwerke items.Comment
-
Bloody Hell
hi WernerOriginally posted by werner p.
Bloody hell iam shocked , like i mentioned iam in no way an expert in german camo and i believed this to be 100% genuine and hope by some way it still is , I do know for a fact that i have personally owned this smock for 3 years and the person before that has had it in his collection for a long time so i wonder if he knows these facts and i will email him . I also can see your point about the camo pattern differance and there is no way i would doubt your knowledge but what i would like to know is if there is any way this could be genuine ie , date testing the materials etc to see if it is a variation as no one knows for certain what happened in the manufacturing period of the war . If It is a repo i will gladly hold my hand up and say i didnt know and that i am shocked and it has definately finished my german collecting and would gladly eccept it back and offer peter an appology .
I can only say that when i studied the smock and listened to how it was made constuction wise and compared it to the copy i first purchased there was a total differance , material , stitching , construction etc so i hope not just to say its not real just because of a pattern variation, this is what i was meaning when i compared it to yours in your book
regards
andy
andyComment
-
Hey Werner and Andy,
This is not much but whats the difference between the Heer pattern and the Luft pattern on HBT? Maybe something to consider. You made me dig out my ground jacket and compare it next to the screen. If you want I can post a few photos later.
MichaelComment
-
patterns
please MichealOriginally posted by MGN
anything to help in this matter and does anyone else have any ideas how this smock can be tested ???????
andyComment
-
Michael, Andy,
As far as the LW pattern goes we're talking 2 completely different animals. They look similar but the LW design consists of smaller patches and have a lot more edges. No the smock Andy has is based on the Heer pattern.
I feel for you Andy.I've been looking at pics since last night and I think Werner is right.Scary to think there might be a near perfect copy out there! If the only issue is the camo design itself we're in trouble. It won't take long to correct that.
I'm still trying to digest what Werner pointed out. To tell the truth I have never looked at camo items in the detail Werner has, but I think we're at that stage in the hobby.
I need to find my smock to compare.Andy since you said your smock has been around a while, I could be in the same boat.
Let me do some more research and provide you my opinion.
JimComment
-
Here is my ground jacket, I have no worries about this one, a vet bring back, shoulderboards are original to the jacket and have been on it since then.Comment
-
The back:Comment
-
LW splinter pattern
LW splinter pattern is completely different from WH splinter pattern ( see the pattern section in my book)
So far I have not encountered miscellaneous prints in LW splinter pattern.
Hell, before this smock I didn't see misprints of this type in WH splinter pattern either !
It really makes me sick and I really hate what is happening here ( sorry Andy) but the fact remains the same, something is wrong with the splinter pattern shown in this smock.
I have seen real close up shots of the cloth.....to me it looks like real wartime HBT weaving. Stitching, cords.. all look OK. So if the print had been right... I'd say it's an OK smock...
WernerInterested in all E. Reitz Uniformwerke items.Comment
-
Werner,
I find it a bit hard to believe that the material is real but the print is off. In either case the best move in my opinion is to get rid of the smock, it may be the wrong move(maybe an undiscovered pattern) now but it also a safe move until a period textbook one appears on the market.
Isn't it possible for Lw HBT Pattern to have been used on a smock like this?
MichaelComment
-
I finally finished formatting pics of my smock and doing some careful study against Andys.Werner I would ask you to look at mine with the same critical eye for detail you did with Andys. The important thing is getting to the truth.If mine turns out to be fake..then I just chalk it up to experience.Heres front view 1.Comment
-
HERES another front view just lightened up a bit.I looked at the camo closely but didn't see anything that concerned me here.Comment
-
Heres the back.There was something that looked odd.See next pic for explanation.Comment
-
the circled area concerned me but it turned out to be a shadow.A closeup of the area is shown.Comment
-
heres the inside.Mine has been field modified by adding a cotton liner which was dyed green. It makes sense because the HBT material was'nt all that sturdy and the white defeated the camo effect.Comment
Comment