USA: Effects of reinstatement of the "assault weapons ban" on our collecting?

[theinglebaby23]

I've read on President Elect Obama's website that he's all in favor of reinstating (permanently) the ban on assault rifles. I didn't start collecting firearms until after the ban was lifted, so it didn't have much effect on me. But, from what I understand however, anything that shot semi-auto or had a bayonet lug was considered an assault rifle and was banned.

How did the ban effect C&R qualified firearms, if at all? Specifically, every WWII long arm had a bayonet lug or was semi-automatic. How are they effected? As collectors, what are we looking at in the next year or so?

Thanks,
Rich

Note: This post is not intended to stimulate political discussion in any way, just to discuss the potential impacts of projected legislation on the future of firearm collecting. Please keep it that way. Thank you.

[ChrisCook]

Assault Weapons Ban

The original ban affected the manufacture and importation of hi cap mags, and also the manufacture of new weapons with "evil features" such as a bayo lug, etc Many manufacturers got around it by deleting bayo lugs, and using thumbhole "sporter stocks." The prices of magazines (high caps) skyrocketed during the ban, and dropped accordingly with the passing of the ban.
The original ban had a 10 year time frame, at that point it could "sunset." President Bush didn't renew it. The next ban will not have a sunset period, it will be permanent. The prices on many "black rifles" have already started shooting up dramatically. By the way, the original ban had little, if any, effect on crime rates. It was an expensive proposition with little result.

My fear, and that of other folks is this:
1) Supreme Court appointments...there will be a few vacancies coming up, and the next Justices will not be favorable to guns.
2) With all 3 branches of government in one parties control the odds are against gunowners. i.e. Pelosi, Feinstein, Schumer, Rahm Emmanuel, Biden, Obama....they all have had very negative stances towards individual ownership of guns.
3) The new AWB ban specifically mentions the M1 Carbine...will our WW2 weapons be at risk?????
4) Could this be a step towards registration and then confiscation of Semiautomatic weapons?
5) We had a positive ruling on the 2nd ammendment this summer with the Heller case vs. DC, however some lower justices are already misusing the rulings from this case.

If confiscation of weapons doesn't occur the values of weapons will go up quite a bit I suspect, will our current semiauto weapons become the next "Class 3" weapons? Manufacturers will not be protected from frivilous lawsuits, a tax of 500% on ammunition has been proposed, a ban on all semiautomatic weapons has been discussed (Obama before the presidential run), all Concealed Carry Permits revoked nationwide (again Obama).

I have tried to keep this as factual as I can without political discussion, hopefully it stays on course. Chris...
Here's an interesting link...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR9RN_iSKtg

[busterz111]

Maybe someone should let people know a Revolver is semi automatic

[phild]

There is no doubt that we must be vigilant in order to preserve our rights. I think that trying to impose any draconian infringement on our 2nd amendment rights is a little like trying to kiss a rattlesnake....that is they have to be very carefull!

The backlash of trying to impose the full measure of the Left's agenda has cost them elections in the past and they know it. This specifc issue has been attributed to costing them the 2000 and perhaps the 2004 Presidential election.

We will just have to see how much stomach the new regime has for massive public outcry and resistance to some of their more extreme positions should they try and puch these through.

[Matt Weber]

I don't like to talk politics, because that's not what this forum is for, but I feel I must add to this topic, for the sake of our hobby.

I was extremely disappointed in the election results . I don't know if gun owners didn't vote, or voted the wrong way? But the results could be disasteruous!

Since the election, the sales of "assault rifles" (I hate to use that term, because none of them actually meet the true definition of "assault rifle"), has skyrocketed! I saw one news report of a gun shop in Texas that was selling over 1,000 guns a week!!! Background checks reached a record high in Colorado as well!

My advise to anyone who hasn't done so already, is to buy an "assault rifle". Also, stock up on ammo! Obama isn't dumb. He plans to ban ammo as well, and re-loading equiptment too. He knows banning ammo will be easier to do than banning guns. If he can't ban it, then he'll tax it so high that you won't be able to afford it! He doesn't care that it will cost thousands of jobs, and hurt the economy even more!

The American people voted for "change." Well, guess what, they got it, and now we are all stuck with it. But the idiots who voted for him don't realize that change can be a bad thing, not always a good thing. I don't see how higher taxes, loss of more jobs, and stricter gun laws, is going to boost the econmy. I think it will get even worse .
Copanies are already making drastic moves since the election. Just look at DHL for example. They are stopping all domestic delievers in the USA! That move alone cost over 9,000 jobs in the USA!! The automotive industry is next. Then, the airlines will cut jobs again. It will get worse, I can promise you that!

Obama is already talking about a $500 billion bailout for the automotive companies!! How is that going to help?? Is that really going to make people go out and buy cars? NO! All it will do is delay the layoffs by a month or two, and line the pockets of the management, and top executives. Remember back to post 9/11? When the airlines were really hurting, they recieved a bailout as well. (I can't remember the amount?). What happened after that? They laid workers off anyways!! and gave bonuses to thier top executives to "retain" them, for doing such a good job under difficult times!!!! And they blaimed it all on 9/11!! What a joke! I was one of those employees who got laid off! No notice, no severence pay. They just showed up on a Friday morning, and handed you your layoff papers, and walked us out the door!! In order to survive, I ended up in dept up to my eyes! It's taken me 6 years, and I'm still not out of dept!

Why not give the $500 billion to the American people who are loosing thier jobs, and in dept up to thier eyeballs? Then maybe they could afford to go out and buy a car, payoff loans, or keep thier houses, which would help the economy out.

My advise: if you have a job, go to work, don't bitch about it, work hard, and be happy, and just wait it out.
As for gun collecting, hang onto your guns. Buy an assault rifle, and stock up on ammo now!

That's all I have to say, Sorry for rambling there. I had to vent that off.
Matt

PS- yea that assault weapons ban really helped put a stop to all the drive by bayonettings that were going on!

[theinglebaby23]

True, however, public outcry for gun rights is pretty weak right now (with the main focus being primarily dedicated to economics). It wouldn't be too difficult to slip in more restrictive gun legislation without too much effort.

However, I doubt that Obama is going to be able to do all that he said he wants to do though. Hopefully all that will come out of it is another ban like the last one so I can sqeeze in a few more and get them "grandfathered in".

How did the last ban effect bolt-actions with bayonet lugs (mosins, K98s, arisakas, etc.)?

[Alan Smith]

Even if future bans don't actually catch the collectable guns that are appropriate for discussion on this Forum, we have to watch out for bans on "high capacity" magazines. Under the various proposals, 30 round mags for collector stuff like MP-40's, MP-44's, Jap. Type 99 LMG, etc. would be banned from future import.

I don't care too much for comercially-available modern arms, but in anticipation of the election results over the past year I've purchased a semi-auto AK-47 and about 5,000 rounds of ammo for it, along with a "high capacity" trench shotgun (Mossberg 590) and about 300 rounds of buckshot ammunition.

Some of this was due to having seen the civil unrest that followed Hurricane Katrina in 2005 and wanting to be prepared for same in the event of future natural disasters or terrorist strikes, but a LOT of my motivation has been the little bits and pieces of information over the past year or so that made things look increasingly like the dream of an O'Bama Presidency would be realized. Well, it's a reality now and I'm awfully glad to have purchased everything at "pre-O'Bama" prices over the past year.

[herbert38]

The fact of the madder is either candidate would have the job of cleaning up this mess we're in. The fact that i have been laid off for the last 3 mouths is not good I have not had the money to go out and buy a new gun or buy ammo as high as it is right now. Food & house come first everything else is a luxury right now. I voted for my job. The plain fact is no job cant afford gun or ammo. Don't know what Obama will bring to the table we will see. Just dont see thing getting all scary & shore as hell dont see thing getting any worse, we have been there many times and we always seem to bounce back. just a thought

[Terry K.]

Hi All,
After reading and listening to what BHO has had to say before his running for president and during his run, I am scared to death. If half of his gun views are enacted and any of his Marxist type views on businesses, I believe most of the businesses will close or move off shore(the rest of them). We were told that my employer(USPS) will be delievering all of DHL's packages. I hope for the best and prepare for the worst. I have an FFL and called 10 distributors last week for some black rifles and was tpld there was a 10-15 week wait.
Yours,

The fact of the madder is either candidate would have the job of cleaning up this mess we're in. The fact that i have been laid off for the last 3 mouths is not good I have not had the money to go out and buy a new gun or buy ammo as high as it is right now. Food & house come first everything else is a luxury right now. I voted for my job. The plain fact is no job cant afford gun or ammo. Don't know what Obama will bring to the table we will see. Just dont see thing getting all scary & shore as hell dont see thing getting any worse, we have been there many times and we always seem to bounce back. just a thought

[theinglebaby23]

How did the last ban effect bolt-actions with bayonet lugs (mosins, K98s, arisakas, etc.) if at all?

[ChrisCook]

Weapons

Bolt actions were not affected under the last ban...the issue with the new presidency is that BO wants to increase ammo costs massively, also a ban on importation of surplus weapons and ammo. If you don't reload now, it may be a good time to get into it, and stock up on componenets (powder, brass, primers, the works). Chris...

[Bob Hritz]

Thank George Bush; HE elected Barak Obama.

However, with all the problems facing President-elect Obama, I highly doubt he will have the time or energy to worry about guns in the next two years. Afther that, he will spend 2 years campaigning fo reelection and no gun laws pass during campaign season.

Pray that President-elect Obama will find the strength and courage to make wise choices and work for all the people. Pray that common sense dictates and that can devote himself to the problems at hand, which are far worse than firearms ownership.

Oh, by the way, your firearms are registered when you fill in the form 4473 and the instant phone check makes a second registration of the firearm. Buying something you think may be banned will only result in giving it away if it should become unlawful to own. Remember, there are two separate registrations that you have completed when you buy a firearm.

Bob Hritz

[ChrisCook]

Firearms.

BO won't have to do the "dirty work" against the 2nd ammendment, Pelosi and company will do it for him, and he'll sign off on the bills w/o hesitation. While there are a lot of things on the "plate" right off the bat for the Dems, they may be eager to get antigun legislation in "under the radar." Also, I could be wrong, but the form 4473 stays with the dealer until they either relinquish their license, die, etc. Then said forms go to the government.
Secondly, I'm pretty sure that on the NICS phone check those records have been mandated to be destroyed within 24 hours, they cannot be retained (well, at least according to the law) ..... That said if I had two identical weapons, one that was bought private party, and one that came through a dealer, I would definitely part with the "dealer bought" weapon first. Chris...

[Andy Harris]

HR 1022 is still alive as well. This would make it difficult to transfer our collections to family members.
Unfortunately, I lost my job ten days ago, otherwise I'd be stocking up on ammo, spare magazines, and parts. And, I'd probably try to get that rifle and/or pistol or two I've always wanted, while they're still available.

[Bob Hritz]

Chris,

I know for a fact that every instant gun check is computerized and run against a database to see what 'patterns' of firearms an individual is buying or selling (trade-ins, etc). The BATF is using local law enforcement, on a detailed to BATF salaried basis, to accomplish this goal.

Yes, form 4473, along with the bound dealer sales and transfer book, is kept with the dealer. There are periodic checks on dealers who show 'unusual patterns' of transfers, whatever that means. With tightening of gun laws, there are more checks and dealers who relinquish their licenses and surrender their records.

The good news is that in the year of 2007, more money was spent on 'shooting sports' than on golf. That is the first time that has ever happened and is a direct result of the sport of single action shooting. There are far too many millionaires who collect exotic firearms for there to be a total ban on ownership. It may get a litte more restrictive, but I doubt it will be any more strigent than the eight years of the Clinton presidency. Those southern and western Democrats are all elected by hunters and sportsmen.

Do I trust the government? I think you know the answer to that.

Bob Hritz