SS Knot?Original?

[Billy G]

Jeremy,

I don't think the knot is worth more than any ordinary Heer or Luft knot. True it will dress up a bayonet but these knots are not without their questions & issues. These knots appear on a lot of dealers' sites as SS knots but who knows?

I think Schupo summed it up perfectly, it MIGHT be SS but there's absolutely no proof. That said, if you like it, buy it but I wouldn't place any extra emphasis on it.

[pvluger]

Jeremy,

if you like it, buy it but I wouldn't place any extra emphasis on it.

Well said.

[M Wipf]

Original SS knot!

Produced by the firm "Gebr. Aurnhammer" in Weißenburg.

Regards Jim

Jim,

You have made a bold statement, we are waiting to see your proof ..

All the best ..

Mike W.

[REMUS]

Thank you everybody for the replys,and good advice.
Iwill contact the seller(I want the S84/98 anyhow)and tell him about the knot.If he sells it for a normal price(not SS price)I will take it.Most of you guys think it's original,so why not?Maybe one day new information or photo's pop up,about this knot.That's one of the fun parts of collecting
Or let's hope Jim has more info for us.

Kind regards,Jeremy

[sb98]

Jeremy,

This knot is one that was discussed in your thread "Blue knot, what is it for??" from a few months ago http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...d.php?t=353839 There appear to be at least 3 color combinations that can be found for sale in mint condition, and there's no evidence of any of them in use.

[Larry Lipps]

I think the term "MOST" collectors think this knot is good is a stretch. I think most collectors have doubts until some type of proof is tendered.

[M Wipf]

I think the term "MOST" collectors think this knot is good is a stretch. I think most collectors have doubts until some type of proof is tendered.

You are probably right .. These knots have been around for quite awhile and you newer collectors aren't familiar with them.. I can't remember which person it was, either Tom Wittmann or Tom Johnson, told me they knew the person that had turned up a big box of these unissued knots. Also that these are certainly from the TR period. No actual documentation .. So far ..

All the best ..

Mike W.

[REMUS]

Thanks everybody for your replys.

Tim,I completely forgot about that thread.So it's a mistery that maybe never clear up.Some say original,but the use is unknown,some say they are early fakes.Will we ever know??Who knows?
I will buy it-at least if the price is right-because I have the feeling these are going to be discussed in the future again.

This frog comes with the bayonet.Seller says he has this bayonet for 35 years,with the frog and knot.I know,sellers say whatever they want.
I know this is the so called"skeletonized frog",and most come with RBnr.These are scarce late war frogs,made to wear with a new type of shovel.

Anyone can say for sure it is authentic?

[Varsity]

Ow, Sorry that I dind't react guy's I missed the thread.

I've some of these knot's. And I've have them form the men who have took them in 1946 at the Factory from Aurnhammer in Weißenburg. He thought he could make money on it in Holland. But the fact that they were in the SS color (also well known in Holland) didn't sell best. He had a dead stock of knots. I've had a large amount of his knots and still have about 15/20 examples. New old stock, bound together.

I do have his personal writing with signature in which he confirmed how these came into his possession. I never asked him to made it, he was a cloth merchant.

You can believe me, or not. I know there are always disbelievers. And that's you good right.

I believe the story, but I also believe that these knot's were only a few issued and mostly are unissued stock. Therefore less attractive but IMO original.


Regards Jim

[REMUS]

Thank you Jim for your reply.

Does anyone have on opinion on this reply?It is considered as original by most,and when you look at the material and construction of the knot,it looksTR era.

Could Jim's story solve the mistery of these knots?
I am not trying to pull anyone to the "believers"side of this knot,because I did'nt buy it,seller wanted $600 for the bayonet and knot
I just like to get this history of this knot cleared up,as probaply most of you do

[GaryMJ]

Both Wittmann & Johnson seem to accept these as period, but latewar. Wittmann shows a period photograph with one on these knots attached to a sabre. Pages 610-611 of Witty's SS Bible.

Many collectors accept these as period, but most don't like them as so many surfaced in the 70's as new leftover stock, as descibed by Wittmann.

Red

[M Wipf]

For those that do not have a copy of Tom Wittmann's excellent SS book, "Exploring the Dress Daggers and Swords of the German SS", here is what is stated about the knot being discussed on this thread.

The knot attached to the saber on page 610 isn't the same style knot we are discussing here. That one is larger with a silver cap on the acorn. On page 611, there is an image of the same knot being discussed in this thread that has a silver cap on the acorn. One with the black cap on the acorn is not pictured. Tom refers to the two different colors as a manufacturer's variance. He claims these were introduced late in the period and few were produced as the war had begun to negate the wearing of swords. Many of these knots were discovered in the original boxes after the war by a European dealer and were introduced to collectors in the 1970s. Tom states that these knots have received unjustified negativity over the years.

Many feel these knots are from the Third Reich period, but there is no actual documentation or photo evidence to substantiate this ..

All the best ..

Mike W.

[Billy G]

Red & Mike,

Well said Gents.

They may indeed be period but because of when they came "out of the woodwork", people often are skeptical. I'm no different & while the 2 Toms like them as period, I still think it's an item that will not bring the money anything associated with the SS would bring. We might have a better idea on whether they're period constructed if someone were brave enough to disect one.

[M Wipf]

That knot is considered original by most, but nobody knows anything about them. No documentation, no period photographs. Is it even SS?

These are often found in unissued mint condition with the original string tie.

They sell for $75 to $125.

All the best ..

Mike W.