SA dagger by Ed Wüsthof?

[Skipper Greenwade]

Karin,

You also need to be aware that the grip eagle and insignia on the replacement grip may be at issue. Your dagger should have the early, nickel-silver eagle (as it does) the replacement grip may have the wrong style eagle and/or one fo the later versions made of aluminum - totally wrong for a Rohm dagger.

I'm with the others who have posted here in favor of leaving the grip as-is.

Best wishes and welcome to the Daggers Forum!
Skip

[Serge M.]

Karin,
I concur with rbminis. Will will see when you get the new grip how poorly it will fit to your crossguards. And you would have replaced an original Rohm Wusthof grip with a "Brand X".

Again IMO....Do Not try to improve it, do not switch any parts.

-wagner-

Oh, another question regarding the grip I traded. I don't have images of it (I know, I know, I might have been silly, and tragically ripped off, but I like to think positive, at least until I'm proven wrong, and hey, them fakes of me are of no use anyway, I think). I believe my dagger to be early period. How can I find out from what period the "new" grip is when it arrives? Does anything give that away? I think the eagle might tell something, but how? And what? Please advice


Regarding the Röhm marks; are they actually Röhm marks? Spots left behind after a ground? Or grinding? Or whatever it is called?

Karin,
As for as whether you new handle is an early one or not: The eagle on your wusthof is made of nickel silver, if the new handle eagle appears to be made of aluminum, then it is a later model.
The marks left over from your inscription are simply parts of the engraving that were etched too deep into the blade to be removed without causing too much damage to the blade.
Hope that I have been of some help,
Ralph.

[Krullies]

Karin, do not do this.
At least wait until your new handle shows up before making any changes.

Thanks Ralph Already I did my shopping and got myself a transparent sponge tipped shoe wax I'm glad I didn't put the sponge to the wood yet Is there anything I actualy can do in order to improve, or stop deteriorating of, the grip? I'm not sure if it gets worse or not, but still, I'd like to not find out

[Krullies]

Thank you

Hi Skip,

Karin,

You also need to be aware that the grip eagle and insignia on the replacement grip may be at issue. Your dagger should have the early, nickel-silver eagle (as it does) the replacement grip may have the wrong style eagle and/or one fo the later versions made of aluminum - totally wrong for a Rohm dagger.

I'm with the others who have posted here in favor of leaving the grip as-is.

Best wishes and welcome to the Daggers Forum!
Skip

Thanks for the warm welcome And thanks for your remarks. There have been some PMs about this as well, but as for your remarks, indeed, I might have been a "little" wet behind the ears/green/novice/silly by responding to the very first person whom I don't know and who claims to be able to fix my cracked grip "problem"

I will keep you, and everybody here, posted on the course of affairs; when (and if) the grip arrives, what kind of grip it is, if it fits or not etcetera. Of course, and I can't stress this enough, I'll never ever EVER will get rid of the original grip. Not even if the "new" grip fits like a glove, or better, even perfect, compared to the original grip. I'll always keep the original grip with the dagger. They came such a long way as a pair Who am I to change that team? I won't do it

Thank you, all of you, for sharing your thoughts and information. Somehow I am rather anxious to find out what exactly is being send to me, grip-wise. Worst that can happen is me loosing two fakes plus registered shipping charges, or me turning two fakes into one fake, which could be seen as not a real loss anyway However, I'll let you and everyone here know as soon as I find out

Very best regards,
Karin-Renate

Thanks Ralph Already I did my shopping and got myself a transparent sponge tipped shoe wax I'm glad I didn't put the sponge to the wood yet Is there anything I actualy can do in order to improve, or stop deteriorating of, the grip? I'm not sure if it gets worse or not, but still, I'd like to not find out

Karin,
I did not see any indication of the crack on the back of the grip, although you did not concentrate on any photos of the back. Are there any signs of glue applied to the crack on the front? As much as I hate to say it in front of all of the other members, it might be possible to repair it, at least so that it does not get any worse.
Ralph.

[Krullies]

No traces of glue

Hi Ralph

Karin,
I did not see any indication of the crack on the back of the grip, although you did not concentrate on any photos of the back. Are there any signs of glue applied to the crack on the front? As much as I hate to say it in front of all of the other members, it might be possible to repair it, at least so that it does not get any worse.
Ralph.

Well, I guess if anyone could, or would know how to, it would be you Your hands are among the most skilled, if not THE most skillful

Indeed, I didn't give the back of the grip proper attention, I'm sorry Please find two close ups below;

Lower part of the grip:


Upper part of the grip:


There is no damage on/to the backside of the grip as far as I can see. The crack starts showing on the sides. The images below gives the best view on this:

Origin/endpoint of upper crack (above the eagle's right wing):


Origin/endpoint of lower crack (below the eagle's left wing):


The crack starts and stops at the opposite sides of the grip. It does not reach the back. I see no traces of glue, but that doesn't mean it isn't there. Maybe it got repaired professionally, using something other than glue. Than again, maybe not. What traces should I look for?

Very best regards,
Karin-Renate

[Wim Vangossum]

Hi Karin,

Someone has used serious power on that grip. The line follows the area were the cut out of the eagle was made. Looks like some kind of pressure used when you would try to open a wooden coffin with the blade. Is the blade bend downwards?

Regards, Theo
(Wim Vangossum)

[Krullies]

Opening closed coffins

Hi Theo

Hi Karin,

Someone has used serious power on that grip. The line follows the area were the cut out of the eagle was made. Looks like some kind of pressure used when you would try to open a wooden coffin with the blade. Is the blade bend downwards?

Regards, Theo
(Wim Vangossum)

Open a coffin? Don't raise any SA men from their eternal sleep! They'll want their daggers back! But, yes, that seems a good possibility as well. It actually was the first thing I thought of before someone said it was due to trying to remove the eagle from the grip. It looked to me like a pencil that broke due to careless playing with it between fingers. That happens to me quite often. I'm a horror to pencils! That's why I believed the damage to the dagger was similar.

Before I learned about that eagle-removing-idea, I spend hours trying to spot any anomalies regarding the blade, its shape, and its position against the grip. The blade is as straight as a razor though. And it is fitted straighter into the grip than my one-piece-construction ruler (if that is even possible, but its just figuratively speaking on my part). I checked it again from different angles when I had the dagger disassembled last weekend. There are no traces of force greater than the knife could handle. The blade is as straight as a zero degree line.

Of course I don't know if "my" blade is in good shape compared to the daggers you guys have, but the shape looks okay. To me, anyway. Although it doesn't have a mirror-like finish, or a scratchless surface.

If you want I'll make pictures of the blade next to a ruler. Not sure how to pull that off though, but I'll think of something

Very best regards,
Karin-Renate

Hello Karin,
Thanks for the compliment,
This kind of damage would appear to me to have been caused by a situation where the dagger was laid on it's front on something that was somewhat soft, but not totally (sort of hard to explain). For some reason, pressure was applied to the back and the cut out and two holes drilled for the mounting of the eagle weakened the front side enough that it cracked. I am not saying that this is what happened, but just picture this, "the dagger was dropped on the ground face down, the ground being some hard and some soft, someone accidentally steps on the back of the handle, as there is a little extra space around the part of the blade that is in the handle, it is possible that this would cause the handle to crack without bending the tang of the blade or cracking right through to the back of the handle"
Just a possibility.
Anxiously waiting to see how your new grip looks,
Ralph

[Krullies]

Welcome

Hi Ralph
You're welcome, and it's the very truth

So you think the crack or split is not caused by an effort to remove the eagle? I understand what you're saying. Interesting theory! You said earlier that there might be (a) way(s) to mend the crack. I'm getting more & more convinced that I should leave it the way it is. Is there any chance of the crack getting bigger? Due to humidity? Or cold? Or both? Or dirt getting inside and nestle cozy in that crack?

Anyway, I can't wait to see what sort of thing this new grip is. Well, IF it arrives ofcourse. What color it is, what materials are used, originality, condition and so on. You and Wim (alias Theo) will be the first to learn about it

Speaking of which, suppose the grip is from a later period than the original grip. There would not be a way to "transfer" the original eagle and roundel to the new grip, I guess? As I type this, I think there will be Wehrmacht-Awards-users that go shout "faul play" and "no way" of course they are right. I'm merely asking this out of interest, purely for information

OK, a wiser question. How do you guys get them blades so shiny and bright? Mine is dull compared to most other daggers I see. Is there a special treatment that results in the shine? Or is it that those blades are less/not used, in contrary to mine?

Very best regards,
Karin-Renate

[sonderverband]

If it were mine I'd be thrilled to have it as is and not mess with it. Congratulations on your find!

[Krullies]

Thanks!

If it were mine I'd be thrilled to have it as is and not mess with it. Congratulations on your find!

Thanks Cyberspace Of course I'm more than thrilled with this pretty piece! It is a genuine historical artefact, stemming from a significant but weird (that's putting it mildly) period in time. That in itself is reason enough to be thrilled. In addition, it is beautiful and impressive. All traces of use make the dagger vivid, as if it is stressing the fact that it was THERE, also making it unique.

Anyway, before I'm getting too poetic; thanks for the compliment

Very best regards,
Karin-Renate

Karin,
I would leave everything the way it is right now and admire it for what it is.
I would not change any thing, unfortunately, the only way to get a shinier blade, is to buy one in better shape.
The only thing that I would suggest is to clean it and give it a coat of Renwax.
The eagle is able to be changed, but requires fine tools and a patient hand, the roundel would be harder.

[Mac 66]

Hi Karin you could clean up the blade with some semi-chrome polish if you wish to make it have a bit of a shine but when a blades lost its crossgrain & been messed with abraisives such as wire wool, sandpaper ect its past its best to be honest. if i were you i would leave you dagger as is & think on selling it on for a much better example you would be proud off, but thats just my opinion...........Regards Scott.