Collection of daggers : kriegsmarine

[Josh B.]

Its definitely a repro. Look at a period one and you'll see the difference. Tom Wittmann is selling one right now, I believe. (Now after checking his website, I believe I am wrong. He must have sold it)

Josh

[ShannonNolan]

I find it hard to judge the market by looking at internet prices. Lakeside Trader has some TRULY amazing pieces, but dang they're high! I had a killer Navy last week on the E-stand, direct vet pickup, hammered scabbard, no problems at all. It had a plain Imperial blade which we conjectured to be a traditional hand me down, possible family piece. Long story short, I let it go for $700 due to lack on interest. I just don't see how anyone's getting $2000 for them.

If you just search a little on the net, you'll see lots of original navies. Look closely at the pics as compared to your dagger, and you'll begin to see the subtle (and not so subtle) differences. However, it's still a cool piece!

[ShannonNolan]

After looking at your pictures, one huge difference comes to my eye is the quality of the finish. Original 3rd Reich pieces were fire-gilded brass. The finish on this dagger has no patina, and almost looks like heavily shellacked paint. Here's a picture of the scabbard from the Navy I sold:

[ShannonNolan]

Also, take a look at the difference in the grips:

[ShannonNolan]

One more shot of the pommel:

[Josh B.]

I find it hard to judge the market by looking at internet prices. Lakeside Trader has some TRULY amazing pieces, but dang they're high! I had a killer Navy last week on the E-stand, direct vet pickup, hammered scabbard, no problems at all. It had a plain Imperial blade which we conjectured to be a traditional hand me down, possible family piece. Long story short, I let it go for $700 due to lack on interest. I just don't see how anyone's getting $2000 for them.

If you just search a little on the net, you'll see lots of original navies. Look closely at the pics as compared to your dagger, and you'll begin to see the subtle (and not so subtle) differences. However, it's still a cool piece!

I mean this in the most respectful way possible, but the reason you got only 700 for that piece is probably because of the blade. If it had the standard blade, I would have bought if off you in a hot minute . Standard issue navys, with lightning bolt scabbard, fouled anchor etch, no knot or hangers would be worth from about 700-1000 in exc. condition. With Exc++ to near mint with lots of gilding left, be prepared to spend more...

For an original piece with hand chaised custom scabbard, and maybe a ivory handle get ready for the 2000-3000 dollar range. As for the naval honor dagger on the other hand, lets just say I'll never need to know because I know I'll never be able to buy one.

Josh

[ShannonNolan]

I feel you there, Josh! Yea, you're right about the blade. Imperial or family piece or not, I was kinda hoping for that nice etched blade! However, I'll get my chance. The reason I've been so hot on the estand lately is cause I'm scraping up funds for this veteran lot which should be in my hand by next week. Ehem... hold on to your drawers, gent

[ShannonNolan]

pic2

[ShannonNolan]

That portepee hasn't been unwrapped since '45 or before. Does that one float your Navy boat?

[Josh B.]

I feel you there, Josh! Yea, you're right about the blade. Imperial or family piece or not, I was kinda hoping for that nice etched blade! However, I'll get my chance. The reason I've been so hot on the estand lately is cause I'm scraping up funds for this veteran lot which should be in my hand by next week. Ehem... hold on to your drawers, gent

Holy Shnikes! An instant collection! What luck to run into a lot like that. Looks like a WKC heer model, no?

[ShannonNolan]

I can hardly sleep! The Heer is actually an Ernst Pack und Sohne, with the large Siegfried trademark! Anyway, I didn't mean to derail the thread on the Navy dagger. If I'm not mistaken, the scabbard on the first dagger shown was never used during the Third Reich period. I believed them to either be the hammered or lightning bolt etched scabbards, correct?

[Josh B.]

I can hardly sleep! The Heer is actually an Ernst Pack und Sohne, with the large Siegfried trademark! Anyway, I didn't mean to derail the thread on the Navy dagger. If I'm not mistaken, the scabbard on the first dagger shown was never used during the Third Reich period. I believed them to either be the hammered or lightning bolt etched scabbards, correct?

I can imagine...I wouldn't be able to sleep either! Thought the heer crossguard looked like the "hatchet beaked" WKC bird, but I guess my eyes arent' as sharp as I thought they were. Nice piece none-the-less of course! I'm not 100% sure they weren't available during the TR. I think Wittmann's book has at least one that was attributed to a TR officer, but don't know if the one I'm thinking of is a pommel upgrade or special purchase piece. But you are right in noting that the vast majority of TR produced kreigs dolchs have lightning bolt or hammered scabbards (with the latter available at extra cost). Both of these styles also pre-dated the period as I'm sure you are also well aware.

Great find on those toys, and love those well worn portepees!

Josh

[ShannonNolan]

Thanks for the kudos, man. I don't have the Wittman book you mentioned, so I've never seen a scabbard like this ever in any reference I had. I guess my last piece of advice (one that I'm catching up on myself), is to get as many books as possible and arm himself with knowledge. That's the only way to make it in this hobby. If I keep doing it another 40 or 50 years, I might just have a handle on it!

[kenny andrew]

cheers for the info guys