SS "Crusher" on estand

[Ohlau]

The court is...

Hard to belive in all this.

Maybe it is the only way in this case.

[Robert H]

Isn't it easier in the eastern Territories to solve problems like this?
I even cannot look thru who fooled who

[Arran]

Hire a Gypsy- its cheaper and you won't have that slimy feeling you get from dealing with a lawyer...

[Lassi]

When will it end? If you buy an expensive item you should post it for opinions right away. First of all the seller moste likely still have the money, and will be able to return them..... Waiting a year and the seller most likely have spent them

To be honest I dont belive in the life time gaurentee....... It have to end at some point and a two week return policy would be enough time to get the thing checked...... Other wise start collecting something else less expensive or at least ask some of the guys for opinions..... Im not a cap expert and BenVK have been kind enough to help me out a couple of times, when buying some expensive

I think we all have spent money on something and got ripped off.... It sucks big time I know.
I traded a mint first pattern DD Lw and a nice ss dagger for a ss jacket that turned out to be fake after a couple of years.... The a.hole and local collector who ripped me off I still hate for that and it has lerned me an expensive lesson, also showed me his true nature as a fake friend who did not care about others....
But I would not claim money back or trade items after a year, at that point the crap has turned into my problem and the trade items were long gone.....

Regards
Lars

[Michael Fay]

We all watched Arek trying to sell fake items on this forum for years and years.
He was quite clever though because he only ever posted one or two poor quality photos which were never enough to prove anything. When asked for more photos, he'd always make some excuse or just ignore the request.
I honestly thought that everyone knew this and avoided him.
It was more of a shock to learn that someone had actually bought one of these crushers for 10k euro than it was to learn that he'd run off with the money.

Just started to read this thread. ANd have only gotten to this post
(post 33).
Hello BenVK,not necessarily directing this at you:
I have to post here that as I am not an SS fabric or hat collector, I never knew his items were so often considered questionable.
Simply put,I did not know Besslien had a history of questionable cloth/hat items.
I wonder why those who knew did not start to question every suspicious item-EVERY TIME, so everyone else might become aware?

If no one in the field sticks their necks out and gets "dirty" by causing a stir against iffy items, then no one knows except the few who specialize in that field--right?.

In an area I believe I do know somthing I have stuck my neck out. I got a ton of grief from many members. BUT, everyone also knows now about the questionable items I knew were not kosher.
If no one speaks out...no one will do anything about it-and newbies in any field get ripped off.

[BenVK]

Michael,

Up until a few years ago, cloth headgear items on the estand used to be policed and vetted quite heavily.

For the most part though, it was a thankless an unpleasant task to be the one who "sticks their necks out and gets "dirty" and I think a lot of collectors got tired of doing it.

I'm also a firm believer in self education. There is enough information here on this forum for anybody and everyone to become proficient in their chosen areas of collecting. No one should expect knowledge to just be handed to them on a plate.

For the record, no one ever asked my opinion of any of these crushers until very recently. By then though, it's obviously too late.

[derka]

I'm also a firm believer in self education. There is enough information here on this forum for anybody and everyone to become proficient in their chosen areas of collecting. No one should expect knowledge to just be handed to them on a plate.

I wouldn't have been able to write it better.
A buyer HAVE TO assume his responsability when purchasing an item, wich mean to have the necessary minimal knowleledge before considering his quest.
If you can't authenitificate an item by yourself for sure, just don't buy it, but don't blame other collectors for your own eventualy wrong decisions, just stand them.
If you buy an item because you trust its seller (whoever it would be), you don't deserve it.
I know, tought words specialy for young collectors.
That said, if a seller is a crook, a swindler, and don't send what is bought, or refuse to take it back during checking period, it is another story.
But collecting TR militaria is not like going to the supermarket, a common mistake i observed nowdays with the net facilities : it is not only a question of avaible money.
derka

[Michael Fay]

Michael,

Up until a few years ago, cloth headgear items on the estand used to be policed and vetted quite heavily.

For the most part though, it was a thankless an unpleasant task to be the one who "sticks their necks out and gets "dirty" and I think a lot of collectors got tired of doing it.

I'm also a firm believer in self education. There is enough information here on this forum for anybody and everyone to become proficient in their chosen areas of collecting. No one should expect knowledge to just be handed to them on a plate.

For the record, no one ever asked my opinion of any of these crushers until very recently. By then though, it's obviously too late.

Hello BenVk
I too, agree on self education. But still, I also think WAF needs a whistle blower program. As we both seem to agree...to call out problems is a "thankless and dirty job," but it should not be.
Attitudes need to change as this aspect on WAF/collecting world helps fraudulent thieves.
No other way to state it.

BenVK, I have not even tried to collect in this area...(except as a newbie when i got ripped off royally at a gun show and a stranger came up to inform the cap was a fake and he even started a fight with the seller)I read up on caps many times over the years (early on when prices seemed more plausible to me), but it is not enough. Without hat in hand and to know exactly what reading material is truly credible(and where they made mistakes) is not always easy.

[kammo man]

Another sad episode .
Again Greed is king.

[Kreager]

Like Ben mentioned the headgear collectors used to really police the e-stand, pretty nicely. If you ever see a questionable cap feel free to post a link, and if you offend someone, O'well, they'll get over it. Maybe this will slow down (will never stop) sellers from posting questionable caps.

[Palmenmuster]

Like Ben mentioned the headgear collectors used to really police the e-stand, pretty nicely. If you ever see a questionable cap feel free to post a link, and if you offend someone, O'well, they'll get over it. Maybe this will slow down (will never stop) sellers from posting questionable caps.

I totally agree.
Tom

[militarymania]

Crooked Dealers/Sellers will only succeed when other Honest Collectors/Dealers stand by and do nothing....

[cossack1648]

If fakes will start to sneak in on Estand undetected, more and more of them will show with time. It is to our common benefit to expose them and to show crooks that bad stuff will not survive there.

Jack

[stonemint]

My understanding is that the hat in question was not sold on the e-stand, but was by a private transaction.

In any event, the e-stand is well-policed with regard to visors--that is why we have so few end up on the Forum for discussion. I have seen maybe 3 questionable visors appear in the last 2 years that I can think of, and those were the result of an honest mistake by the sellers. (as I do not collect crushers/M-43's/Schiffchens, I leave it to others to "police" them.)

In the early days of the forum, we did not have everthing organized as to both fakes and originals as we do now, and they have all been called out: the Altestes; Janke's; Derwigs; Deibels; Heavyweights; N&T Globals; Flochs; BRD Poseurs; Frankies; Pinking Shears; etc. If a mistake by a buyer is made, it is most often the result of simply having failed to review the pinned threads/do a simple forum search/or seek input BEFORE purchasing.


The bottom line is that as a result of this forum's seven-year existence, fake visors have pretty much dried up in terms of being sold (or attempting to be sold) on the E-stand. I have also seen prices fall dramatically on Ebay when it comes to the above fakes, the simple result of our combined efforts to preserve both the integrity and future of this hobby.

So, the moral of the story is read, look at the pictures, and if you are still not sure, post BEFORE you buy.

[turbopanzer]