Detecting Fakes, relined or put together visors.

[jacquesf]

Nick illustrating Erel sweatband attachment.

"Erelstitch ref

Stonemint I might as well post this since I was just telling another member this. If you take apart an Erel you will learn that the sweatband is actually pretty easy to reattach undetected. The leather and oilcloth reed are one piece (so to speak). They are sewn together then attached to the cap base with a stitch where my arrow points (not the V-stitching but in between the oilcloth and leather). If you own an Erel stick you fingernail in these and look, you will see the stitching. If sneaky individuals wanted to they could remove a sweatband from a visor without disturbing the exterior stitching you see. Then re-sew it back in. If the stitches are tight enough you can not tell. I think most collectors look at the exposed stitching and if it looks good just assume the cap is good. This is not the case with Erel’s. I hope I didn’t give out too much info here but I don’t want anyone getting a false sense of security when looking at Erel’s I would say next to the Pekuro sweatbands these are the next easiest to reattach.

Second pic.

"Erelstitch1 ref
Here is a better shot where you can see the thread.

[jacquesf]

Questionable Erel stitching for comparison.

[jacquesf]

SJP regarding liner replacement.

"Erelstitchliner ref
Erel sweatbands conveniently lend themselves for reinstallation
Attached Images

Important link
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...hlight=erel+ss "

[jacquesf]

Questionable for comparison

[wolfslair44]

First, I truly want to thank all those that are helping with their expertise. That said, in looking at the pics, what is it that stands out as it being put together versus 'original' untouched. I guess, for those of us who are not experts, what is in the picture that makes it be a 'franky' or 'fake'? I'm really not sure what I am looking at with the arrows, etc., in the pics below. I hate coming on here and asking 'is this good' without first being able to understand really what I should be looking for.

Thanks again everyone for all your contributions!
Scott

[Robert H]

now compare the correct stitching to the SS crusher cap that was recently getting discussed.

[jacquesf]

First, I truly want to thank all those that are helping with their expertise. That said, in looking at the pics, what is it that stands out as it being put together versus 'original' untouched. I guess, for those of us who are not experts, what is in the picture that makes it be a 'franky' or 'fake'? I'm really not sure what I am looking at with the arrows, etc., in the pics below. I hate coming on here and asking 'is this good' without first being able to understand really what I should be looking for.

Thanks again everyone for all your contributions!
Scott

Scott, the arrows in the first pic shows where the stitching that attach the sweatband to the cap is. It is hidden en invisible. The second pic with arrows show where the attachment stitching in the first, is visible. for illustration purposes.

The point is that due to the invisible attachment method used by Erel, fakers can also hide their replace sweatband stitching there, but normally not that tidy and well. Also remember the sweatband has to come of to"transplant" an erel liner into a cap and then be replaced after. Erel is relative simple to do that and hide it. Therefor a lot of Erel internals are used on other cap bodys, like ss. There by the term Frankenstein. When a liner a transplanted, they struggle to get the side pleats right. That is why the pleating can often be a good" tell" .I hope my basic explanation helps. J

[wolfslair44]

Scott, the arrows in the first pic shows where the stitching that attach the sweatband to the cap is. It is hidden en invisible. The second pic with arrows show where the attachment stitching in the first, is visible. for illustration purposes.

The point is that due to the invisible attachment method used by Erel, fakers can also hide their replace sweatband stitching there, but normally not that tidy and well. Also remember the sweatband has to come of to"transplant" an erel liner into a cap and then be replaced after. Erel is relative simple to do that and hide it. Therefor a lot of Erel internals are used on other cap bodys, like ss. There by the term Frankenstein. When a liner a transplanted, they struggle to get the side pleats right. That is why the pleating can often be a good" tell" .I hope my basic explanation helps. J

Many thanks for this and the PM (PM'd you back). I am indebted to you and those members, like in this thread, that are helping us learn what to look for with some of these fake visors. My preference, whether in collecting or otherwise, is to try and find an answer myself first before asking. I don't want to be 'that guy' that always just posts without having tried to figure out myself first. It is why threads like this one are very important. While I do understand what is being pointed out, I dare say I have A LOT more to learn. Thanks to all those who take the time to contribute and assist. Your knowledge and patience is appreciated.

Scott

[Lenny W]

Temporarily closed under construction thanks. And back open