SS Brocade Parade belt your opinion

[Stahlhelm40]

Dear experts, I'm interested in buying the SS Brocade Belt which is listed in the E-Stand. I would like to get the opinion from the experts who understand this belts. Thanks for your opinion.

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru....php?t=1004362


FYI, I checked with the seller if ok, before opening this thread!

[Jean Pierre Redeuilh]

Dear experts, I'm interested in buying the SS Brocade Belt which is listed in the E-Stand. I would like to get the opinion from the experts who understand this belts. Thanks for your opinion.

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru....php?t=1004362


FYI, I checked with the seller if ok, before opening this thread!

Probably alright even if it has some seldom seen characteristics. I should show this thread to my customers if they say my Allgemeine SS brocade in same condition but with a mint 36/38 buckle is expensive when I am selling it for $3100 USD all fee and postage included!!

[Seppen]

Not overly helpful and slightly self promoting

[Jean Pierre Redeuilh]

Not overly helpful and slightly self promoting

... But true.

[N.C. Wyeth]

So what I can tell you from my experience . . .

Amongst all the other SS brocades and buckles . . . yesterday at the OVMS Show in Ohio, I spied two ASS brocade belts that were going for about $1K US each . . . and one SS Officer buckle in Al that was going for about $1.5K US. That being said, I am confident some negotiation could have been conducted . . . but at the end of the day, it would still have been close to a $2.5K US investment for me to have brought a paired ensemble home.

[Stahlhelm40]

Fully agree! The offered brocade belts/buckles here are totally over-priced at all or the condition is just Not Matching the "Dream" price.
It's cheaper just to buy from one of the known dealers, then to but here in the Forum from a privat Person.

Amongst all the other SS brocades and buckles . . . yesterday at the OVMS Show in Ohio, I spied two ASS brocade belts that were going for about $1K US each . . . and one SS Officer buckle in Al that was going for about $1.5K US. That being said, I am confident some negotiation could have been conducted . . . but at the end of the day, it would still have been close to a $2.5K US investment for me to have brought a paired ensemble home.

[Jean Pierre Redeuilh]

close to a $2.5K US investment for me to have brought a paired ensemble home.

In my opinion (everybody knows who I am and what I am doing so I maybe have different values than others) a "paired" ensemble has close to no value to my eyes. Such items cannot say anything about their history, cannot be used as historical evidence, etc... Their only value is future retail potential increase. But greed is now what runs our world... "Paired" items MUST be of MUCH LESSER value than always been together items!! Of course one has to be sure about the provenance or really trust the dealer but that should be the norm. I cannot comment on the submitted Allgemeine SS brocade since the buckle is a 1938 vintage, as expected. Both buckle and brocade COULD had been together since, but it is still not obvious since the buckle was NOT in an expected mint condition. Also, seller was ready to part the brocade from the belt, which let me think that MAYBE this was an association from the start. At least, preserving homogeneity of the set seems to not had been a real concern...Money was maybe more important than historical preservation...

Once again, for myself, ONLY "always been together" had my attention, but I did collect to reveal things, not to own things.

That been said, please read that thread as well:
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru....php?t=1000936

[Stahlhelm40]

I agree with your opinion JP but how do you want to prove that belt and buckle was always together? Usually any certificate is value of Zero. How often did we see that a dealer with a top reputation was starting to be more interessted in making money i/o selling real good goods. IMO you should never buy the Story, only the item itself. And if an item is double of the price than with any other seller, then the item is defenetely over-priced.

In my opinion (everybody knows who I am and what I am doing so I maybe have different values than others) a "paired" ensemble has close to no value to my eyes. Such items cannot say anything about their history, cannot be used as historical evidence, etc... Their only value is future retail potential increase. But greed is now what runs our world... "Paired" items MUST be of MUCH LESSER value than always been together items!! Of course one has to be sure about the provenance or really trust the dealer but that should be the norm. I cannot comment on the submitted Allgemeine SS brocade since the buckle is a 1938 vintage, as expected. Both buckle and brocade COULD had been together since, but it is still not obvious since the buckle was NOT in an expected mint condition. Also, seller was ready to part the brocade from the belt, which let me think that MAYBE this was an association from the start. At least, preserving homogeneity of the set seems to not had been a real concern...Money was maybe more important than historical preservation...

Once again, for myself, ONLY "always been together" had my attention, but I did collect to reveal things, not to own things.

That been said, please read that thread as well:
http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru....php?t=1000936

[Jean Pierre Redeuilh]

I agree with your opinion JP but how do you want to prove that belt and buckle was always together? Usually any certificate is value of Zero. How often did we see that a dealer with a top reputation was starting to be more interessted in making money i/o selling real good goods. IMO you should never buy the Story, only the item itself. And if an item is double of the price than with any other seller, then the item is defenetely over-priced.

You can only prove it to yourself,as a buyer, when you buy it directly from a vet estate or family estate. This was still widely possible years ago but barely today.
Other than that you indeed have to rely on who sells it to you. BUT, fortunately, there is still some indications which are able to tell you if the "story" is true or not. At that point, you need to have some knowledge. If you do not have any, my advise is, do not buy anything from anybody since you are going to be ripped off 99% of the time.

Top reputation was earned, not given free of charge...

...and, I have to add, anybody with something he knows for a fact is genuine, or even with a true story, MUST maintain his/her price, even if his/her price seems "overpriced" to some because his/her price is accurate when others are just junk! Just let people be educated. It will takes time for most but fortunately there is still several who knows what is what. Unfortunately less and less but we cannot change the world. This is one of the reasons I went out of collecting. A lot of ignorants trying to pass for Gods. Too many rotten dealers and too many excellent fakers for not enough honest dealers. This is the world you chose and are living. Accept its consequences...

[Seppen]

Hello fellow members,
I own this belt and buckle and want to sell them.
I was asked by an interested party if it was ok to put the belt on the forum to make sure it was correct, I agreed. It would seem belt is ok. I have not stated belt and buckle were always together and no story was offered or given, it’s just a belt and a buckle. if it is too expensive then negotiation is always possible or do not buy it.
Comments always seem to go off at a tangent on this forum.
Price of the items certainly seem to be in line with others offered in similar condition. But, then, I would say that.
Belt and buckle are still available, so, price negotiation is still available!

[Seppen]

SOLD IT to Fellow WAF member who liked it and negotiated good price.
Thanks to buyer.