Gottschee Tinnie

[rk302565]

Hello everyone

A few years ago I came across a tinnie online marked Gottschee. This is the town my grandparents lived until the 1940's. so I bought it not knowing what it really was. I was hoping that someone here would be able to tell me a bit more about what I have here.

Thanks.
Don

[PBR]

I'm not sure, but this should be a VDA ( Volksbund fur das Deutschtum im Ausland) vet associations supporters pin for former Volksdeutsche members of the, in this case Austro-Hungarian, army living abroad Germany.
I think they are pre-1939 but not sure at all.

I do have few as well but couldn't find any info about them.

http://www.gottschee.de/Dateien/Doku...erklaerung.htm

[Curt Steinbach]

Hello Don - T.K. is correct that it is a VDA pin. Comes from a series of 59 (58 different - Sohrau comes in metal and cardboard) city coat of arms that were issued from 1934 - 1939. A few of them are made of cardboard. For further info you could check out Spendenbelege des VDA 1925 - 1945 by Reinhard Tieste pages 8 - 11.

Holger

[rk302565]

Thanks guys. So I suppose this would have been given to an Austrian Vet of WWI in Gottschee.

T.K., the Gottscheers were relocated in 1941. My grandparents were among those relocated as teenagers. I was able to obtain copies of their resettlement documents which the link you included mentions from the US National Archives. This is off topic for the tinnie section, but check them out as you may find them interesting.

I would welcome any further information on the tinnie, and would love to find someone who knows more about the Gottscheers in particular if there's anyone out there.

Don

[speedytop]

Hi Don,

it is from the VDA "Volksbund für das Deutschtum im Ausland".

Please see here, Post 288, 293 and 296:

http://dev.wehrmacht-awards.com/foru...=12513&page=20

Uwe

[rk302565]

Thanks guys.
If there are any Gottscheers reading this post I'd love to talk to you.

Don

[PBR]

Thanks guys.
If there are any Gottscheers reading this post I'd love to talk to you.

Don

Don, as far as I know there are not Volksdeutschen Gottscheers anymore, most of them were resettled during the 40's while the Red Army and Partisans were approaching the Reich's borders.
The ones remained in place were actually swept off by Tito after the war.

These pin were actually not "awarded" or "given" to vets, but I presume they were bought in order to support the Vet's associations.

I had some research about Gottschee in the past, in relation to the Volksdeutschen and stuff there.

In december 1943 there was a very harsh close combat battle in Gottschee downtown between the Germans and partisans.
The old German castle was almost totally destroyed by fierce fightings.
Here some pictures.

[burgerhaus]

Don You are very fortunate to have that family document. Do you have anything that goes furthur back? Also, can you translate what is written on it? Thanks for showing this. For me personally it is nice to see as I have had very little luck with family research because of lack of documents and lack of elders still living. There is even conflict with my last name being an "assigned" name. A letter I have referring to my Grandfather as Peter Opfermann from a Lutheran minister leads me to suspect this. I digress. Thank You Robert

PS I don't have the tinnie you look for sorry.

[rk302565]

T.K.
You are right, I should have been more specific. I meant descendants of Gottscheers such as myself. I am a member of an organization of this type and receive their newsletter. Here on wehrmacht-awards though, I wonder if someone would be able to point me in the direction of Gottschee collectables or relics? I understand that they would be very rare. So far I have been able to find some postcards and stamps cancelled at the Gottschee post office, along with that tinnie. Maybe there is someone on this board who collects such items?
Also, I see you have an interest in the SS. I have a photograph of one of my grandfather's brothers, also a Gottscheer who was a sturmann. When the Germans evacuated Yugoslavia in 1945 he was sent towards the front, never to be seen again. The other brother was a rottenfuhrer who suffered the same fate.
Don

[rk302565]

Don You are very fortunate to have that family document. Do you have anything that goes furthur back? Also, can you translate what is written on it? Thanks for showing this. For me personally it is nice to see as I have had very little luck with family research because of lack of documents and lack of elders still living. There is even conflict with my last name being an "assigned" name. A letter I have referring to my Grandfather as Peter Opfermann from a Lutheran minister leads me to suspect this. I digress. Thank You Robert

PS I don't have the tinnie you look for sorry.

Robert,

I don't have anything further back than this. There is a picture of my grandmother's father in a WWI Austrian uniform, however this is hers and I would never take it from her. I have been meaning to make a copy of it, eventually I will.
I do have another document from the same time, also a copy from the US-NARA. I don't know exactly what they say as I don't read German, but she explained to me that it is a form accepting German citizenship and renouncing any other citizenship from the Gottscheer relocation of 1941 and 1942.

[PBR]

T.K.
You are right, I should have been more specific. I meant descendants of Gottscheers such as myself. I am a member of an organization of this type and receive their newsletter. Here on wehrmacht-awards though, I wonder if someone would be able to point me in the direction of Gottschee collectables or relics? I understand that they would be very rare. So far I have been able to find some postcards and stamps cancelled at the Gottschee post office, along with that tinnie. Maybe there is someone on this board who collects such items?
Also, I see you have an interest in the SS. I have a photograph of one of my grandfather's brothers, also a Gottscheer who was a sturmann. When the Germans evacuated Yugoslavia in 1945 he was sent towards the front, never to be seen again.
Don

Hello Don,

this sounds interesting.
Do you know which unit your SS relative was enlisted to?
This would be interesting for my research.
I would be also interested into see the picture.

I do collect stuff related to military\civilian Volksdeutschen from Slovenia, Oberkrain, and North Italy, but so far I wasn't able to acquire any item related to Gottschee.
I know of at least one "Umsiedler Ausweis" named to a Gottscheer Volksdeutsche, not in my collection unfortunately: such kind of ID pass are very rare.
I do post the image: the interesting thing is that Gottscheer were considered as Italian citizens Volksdeutschen, despite the fact that Gottschee was in Slovenia, due to the fact that between 1941 and 1943 Gottschee was part of Italy.
In 1943 Gottschee, along with parts of North Italy and lower Slovenia, were annexed by the Deutsches Reich under the name of "Operationszone Adriatisches Kuestenland"

I do have some original pictures of Polizei members (very likely SS-Pol.Rgt.19 and Pol.Nachr.Kp.21) in Gottschee during the battle.

I do also know that a very famous Gold Bandenkampfabzeichen holder, the SS- Obersturmführer Helmut Prasch, a former SD in Pola and then attached to the SS-Karstjager-Division, was honorary member of the Gottscheer Ehrenring after the war, being him president of the Bezirksheimatmuseums in Spittal.

http://www.gottscheer-gedenkstaette....hee_leute2.htm

[rk302565]

TK

Please do get in touch with me if you should come across anything interesting Gottschee related, I'd love to take a look.

Unfortunately I do not know anything about which divisions my grandfather's brothers served in. I do know the following story. The young man you see pictured was shipped towards the front as Yugoslavia collapsed and the German civilian population was evacuated. His unit was decimated and fell apart as the war ended. In the spring of 1945 he and a few other men threw down their guns and their shirts and joined in the lines of civilians headed for the Austrian border. He was stopped, and the tattoo on his arm was recognized by a partisan. He was summarily executed on the side of the road. This story was passed onto his family by one of the other men that had been in his unit who was able to reach Austria. Please excuse the picture being a bit blurry.

As for my grandfather himself he was drafted in 1944 as a Gebirgsjager, Heer not SS. He served in Yugoslavia as well. Unfortunately I have no picture of him in uniform.

Don

[PBR]

TK

Please do get in touch with me if you should come across anything interesting Gottschee related, I'd love to take a look.

Unfortunately I do not know anything about which divisions my grandfather's brothers served in. I do know the following story. The young man you see pictured was shipped towards the front as Yugoslavia collapsed and the German civilian population was evacuated. His unit was decimated and fell apart as the war ended. In the spring of 1945 he and a few other men threw down their guns and their shirts and joined in the lines of civilians headed for the Austrian border. He was stopped, and the tattoo on his arm was recognized by a partisan. He was summarily executed on the side of the road. This story was passed onto his family by one of the other men that had been in his unit who was able to reach Austria. Please excuse the picture being a bit blurry.

As for my grandfather himself he was drafted in 1944 as a Gebirgsjager, Heer not SS. He served in Yugoslavia as well. Unfortunately I have no picture of him in uniform.

Don

Thanks Don.
Is the soldier wearing runes on the collar tab? I cannot understand.
Curious how he doesn't wear the WSS sleeve eagle, but he has indeed WSS collar tabs.
There were not too many WSS divisions in Yugoslavia in 1945, so, it shouldn't be too difficult to have at least a clue about them (I would say Prinz Eugen, Karstjager or Handschar).
The guy is not wearing the Edelweiss, so, any additional infos would help.

Regarding the story of the execution, unfortunately, is a well known story: thousands of unarmed croat Ustasha, slovene Domobranc, german soldiers and any kind of civilian fleeing the frontline were slaughtered in Slovenia before and after the armistice in May 1945, while trying to reach the Reich's border around Bleiburg in Austria (there's also a plate there to remember these victims).
Many of them were also murdered in the area of Gottschee and buried into mass graves or caves, google "Kocevski Rog" to have a general view about the matter.
If I'm not wrong, Slovenia government stated not long time ago that at least 400 mass graves containing such victims were officially discovered up to the present day.

I'm pretty sure Handschar got in the area of Bleiburg from the Untersteiermark, while Prinz Eugen thru the Loiblpass but sure several disbanded sigle soldiers of such units tried to reach Austria around the area of Bleiburg.

I will keep you posted if any Gottschee item will eventually turn out, please send me your mail adress via PM.

By the way, what's the full name of your fallen relatives?
We might be able to track them down.

Bests

[rk302565]

These aren't great either, but a bit better. There are no runes, SS on the right collar, white line on the left. Left sleeve the standard looking 'V' shape.
I've sent you my email address, thanks.

Don

[PBR]

Don,

These are SS runes on the right tab, SS-Rttf. rank on the left one.
Not WSS sleeve eagle, maybe a static defense unit sponsored by WSS such as Selbstschutz or similar?
Who knows.

Bests