Adolf Hitler Napkin Rings

[BrianK]

With respect, in some cases, that's like asking a fat guy if it's lunchtime yet.

[Bill D.]

I have no stake in this discussion, which I find to be very interesting.
One point that seems intriguing to me is the reference to a 1946 newspaper article that relates the existence of an "AH" napkin ring in a veteran's possession. Unfortunately, I presume that there was no photograph of the napkin ring in that article, and so it is possible that the veteran had come across a napkin ring from the "Adler Hotel", or some such entity.

Still, an interesting subject.

[ebj]

I have an AH 925 silver content-marked napkin ring and will accept Ray Zyla's statement. Perhaps the 800 silver content rings were copied from them?!

As I said, I have dealt with Ray for over forty years and respect his opinions.

[praubal]

It would be quite possible that rings were added - ordered after the main order as an item that was not originally requested.

Nothing unusual about that.

[ErichS]

No proof they ever existed and too many questions make them questionable for me and many other collectors to have in their collections.

[J. Wraith]

It would be quite possible that rings were added - ordered after the main order as an item that was not originally requested.

Nothing unusual about that.

If the queen had balls she would be King.

[praubal]

If the queen had balls she would be King.

Is that some sort of French resistance coded message...?

[ebj]

Seems to me the bottom line is: if you think they are fake, don't acquire one. If you have one, it is your decision as to how comfortable you are with it. Who and/or where you got it from are obvious questions.

There are accounts of them being picked up and seen by GIs at the end of the war and having been in the posession of vets later. I have other AH items and my 925 AH napkin ring looks quite nice with them.

[ErichS]

Seems to me the bottom line is: if you think they are fake, don't acquire one. If you have one, it is your decision as to how comfortable you are with it. Who and/or where you got it from are obvious questions.

There are accounts of them being picked up and seen by GIs at the end of the war and having been in the posession of vets later. I have other AH items and my 925 AH napkin ring looks quite nice with them.

Agree with you but you will have a hard time selling them if and when the time comes.

[Richard]

There must be tons of photos of formal dinners with AH out there. Do any of them show any napkin rings? For that matter, are there pictures of napkin rings in use during any NSDAP lunch/dinner event of that period? The biggest hit to these is of all the silverware sets liberated, some with some nearly unique items (asparagus server anyone?), napkin rings are not in the haul. These all appeared independently, never in conjunction, of any other formal silverware. I would think a GI who found these wouldn't just take these and leave all other silverware alone. Yet nowhere do we find these associated with any of the other silverware pieces.

This leaves them in the ethereal world of "what if". What if they were made after the original order, what if they were never delivered, what if Hitler had a phobia of napkin rings and refused to let them be used, etc. That is then down to pure speculation with no documentation or real provenance. GIs brought back tons of fakes they thought were real and the fakers went into business the minute war was over in order to make a buck. There will need to be photographic evidence or paperwork for an order of these discovered before most will recognize them as legitimately produced as part of the formal set. Everything depends on your comfort zone, but mine isn't there with these pieces until something more concrete than speculation turns up.
Richard V

[11C]

If these things were real.........they would need to be 800 silver like the rest of the original set. The 925 hallmark makes no sense at all. Thin napkin rings in soft 925 silver.......... Would not have happened IMO.

[praubal]

They also come marked 800....never the less The simple fact remains ...they exist and apart from opinions they cannot be proven right or wrong.
Like others here I have some spoons and 2 knives and napkins ...and happy with just those...if I was a die hard collector of the full set (which I wouldn't want personally ) I would, regardless of questions..def buy rings to complete the set...real or not.

[ebj]

The reasoning behind some being in 925 silver is they would not have received the heavy use the table ware would have. Either way, they all exist. Why continue to get "wrapped around the axle" on this? Let it go, guys! There are more important "fish to fry"!

[BrianK]

Having lost big dollars to fakes from Zyla's Mohawk Arms auctions his COA does not impress me. Looks like another case of the DJ knives and HJ Olympic knives to me - more stuff with vet stories that old time dealers swear are real.

[11C]

Having lost big dollars to fakes from Zyla's Mohawk Arms auctions his COA does not impress me. Looks like another case of the DJ knives and HJ Olympic knives to me - more stuff with vet stories that old time dealers swear are real.

1st model railway daggers..............

Another example of "dealer speak".......