"Mahnmal" monument centerpiece

[Br. James]

"Actually many ex Nazis were in administrative government jobs during the 50s due to their expertise running gov departments. If they omitted these folks, there would have been very few with the knowhow to run the gov bureaucracy."

A good point, Erich, though I think most of those 'admin types' were far less recognizable than Jakob Grimminger, whose face would have been quite well-known to the vast German public in newsreels as he carried the Blood Flag, led the annual Putsch processions and stood close to Hitler and other highly-visible Nazi leaders. He had a quite recognizable face! Most of those other 'admin types' worked in offices 'upstairs or out of sight of the bulk of the public,' while Grimminger's stern face was probably thought of as an example of the Nazi ideal.

A blessed Memorial Day holiday to all,

Br. James

[Volksturmer]

Erich, I see your point, and James’ point. It is true that in cities like Nuremburg, that had huge bomb damage and deaths, and a very high percentage of dedicated Nazis, it was crucial to hire ex-Nazi administrators to run civil services to keep things running. I’m sure it had to happen all over West Germany. Apparently, male secretaries of the key administrative men, would be given the position of their former bosses; and their bosses, dedicated Nazis all, would be given ‘consultant’ jobs, but would still in some cases occupy their old positions, their old offices, their old desks, and salaries. This is in the OMGUS records. There just was no one else capable.

James is also correct, because, someone like Grimminger was not going to be tenable holding a public position for long, because in the 50’s the cold war was heating up, very hot. Grimminger was radioactive, his face – so associated with the Blood Flag - just would not “fly” with the Western Germans, the Western Allies, with the Communists – with no one. The East Germans and Soviet Communists would pounce on that if he were ever made more than a janitor for long. Even if some Germans wanted to help him, as such a prominent figure, I bet he was put on a permanent ‘watch’ list by the Allies, and trying to help him out in any way was very problematic.

Also, the very rich industrialists were the ones who made it through the post-war years and stayed in power – by using money and influence, IMHO. Without these men, also, the West German economy would never have been revived. If I had to guess where certain very important Nazi artifacts went, I would bet they went to the richest men in Germany.

This is because, the men ‘behind the scenes’, who were Very rich, and ran the crucial industries, and who had stayed out of the limelight, could do what they liked post-war, with the right money sent to the right people.

Also, when the Nazis were defeated, a Huge gap suddenly existed, and the East met the West, and the hammer and sickle met the democracies everywhere. Any Nazi Military Economy Leaders, for example, who were in jobs in West Germany, were ‘outed’ by the Soviet-published Braun Buch, which showed their Nazi background. On the other side of the coin, the Soviets played to the hilt the Prussian Tradition in East Germany, to build up the East Germans. Such a thing was a huge taboo in the West Germany of the time, because it was too close to rebuilding “Nazi values.” Apparently, the East Germans didn’t care if they were using Prussian values for their soldiers, no matter how close to Nazi values they were. This was a new world order!

[Volksturmer]

Mil,

I wrote too much in my last post.

But this is one of the best threads on the forum! Super info and photos, and awesome contributions. I’m still reading through them and enjoying them. Thanks for starting it up!

John

[Robert J.D.]

Here’s a fantastic video covering the fate of many nazi and imperial flags that were seized by soviet forces. Was the blood flag too important to not be among them? Is it conceivable the soviets captured it and didn’t even know it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSXEJ5Ud3Co

[ErichS]

Here’s a fantastic video covering the fate of many nazi and imperial flags that were seized by soviet forces. Was the blood flag too important to not be among them? Is it conceivable the soviets captured it and didn’t even know it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSXEJ5Ud3Co

As far as I know the Russians never occupied Munich so highly unlikely they ever had the BF.

[Robert J.D.]

Very good point, but things were moved, gathered and stored for security reasons as we know, and it could have unfortunately been moved to a place within Soviet occupation. I certainly hope not.

[chen]

There should be the 5th possibility( Ulric's book page 191) of where is the BF beside from this video ( watch starting from 7.10).
https://youtu.be/zAcViWCdZGs

[Volksturmer]

Chen I watched from 7.10 and I agree a 5th possibility should be put into the BF video by Felton.

I swear I thought I saw something about Grimminger selling his GPBs or some other award, in Angolia’s FuF, Politcal and Civil book, but I looked and now I can’t find it. Does anyone remember where that is? Or know anything about Grimminger selling his personal awards? If he sold his badges that would make the Ulric rumor more possible. imo.

[Br. James]

Jakob Grimminger held NSDAP Membership Number 759. In 2009 two separate GPBs bearing this number were sold: A small Fuess-marked GPB w/a stickpin attachment was sold by Ulric of England, and in December of that year, Craig Gottlieb showed a large Deschler GPB w/safety pin w/this number, from his personal collection. So at least some of Grimminger's possessions from the 'Nazi time' have been sold off.

Br. James

[Br. James]

"As far as I know the Russians never occupied Munich so highly unlikely they ever had the BF."

I tend to agree with ErichS' point of view.

Br. James

[chen]

Chen I watched from 7.10 and I agree a 5th possibility should be put into the BF video by Felton.

I swear I thought I saw something about Grimminger selling his GPBs or some other award, in Angolia’s FuF, Politcal and Civil book, but I looked and now I can’t find it. Does anyone remember where that is? Or know anything about Grimminger selling his personal awards? If he sold his badges that would make the Ulric rumor more possible. imo.

Just an interesting side issue:
Supposed the BF is discovered.
Will the present day touching of the blood flag with an other un-consectated erwache still considered as consecration process?

[Military]

Just an interesting side issue:
Supposed the BF is discovered.
Will the present day touching of the blood flag with an other un-consectated erwache still considered as consecration process?

I think you need AH to transfer the mojo.

Mil

[Military]

Jakob Grimminger held NSDAP Membership Number 759. In 2009 two separate GPBs bearing this number were sold: A small Fuess-marked GPB w/a stickpin attachment was sold by Ulric of England, and in December of that year, Craig Gottlieb showed a large Deschler GPB w/safety pin w/this number, from his personal collection. So at least some of Grimminger's possessions from the 'Nazi time' have been sold off.

Br. James

Hi Br. James,

Do we know how much they were sold for?

Mil

[Br. James]

"Do we know how much they were sold for?"

Hi Mil,

So sorry but I neglected to take note of the sale figure of Ulric's piece, and Craig Gottlieb may have shown this badge as a part of his private collection...no figure there, either.

Cheers, my friend, and do stay safe,

Br. James

[Volksturmer]

Just an interesting side issue:
Supposed the BF is discovered.
Will the present day touching of the blood flag with an other un-consectated erwache still considered as consecration process?

Chen,
Point well taken. Mil identifies it perfectly- it is AH who made the NZ mojo work.

It isn’t the fact that the BF somehow consecrated the flags it touched through some supernatural transference. The point is that Hitler made an entire Generation of Germans believe it did, whether it were so or not, and they believed it to be a holy relic, and this belief system changed the course of human history forever.

As a piece of cloth today, it doesn’t transfer anything, any more than the material objects we as collectors own from the NZ era somehow ‘magically transfer’ to us guilt from the crimes of the TR. But tell that to some of the people who see our memorabilia collections. Yikes!