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    Originally posted by JK53 View Post
    So these badges 1st type are not made by the same maker but show the same similarities.So they can be confirmed as genuine ? Because taking a look at three badges owned by Erich S,Erich B,Bob Hritz they're completely different and for such a small amount awarded I personally would have thought you would find some that match.So personally I would not want to own one even less so the second pattern's but if you like them that's all that matters.
    Type 1s are made by one maker.
    Erich
    Festina lente!

    Comment


      Originally posted by Erich B. View Post
      Type 1s are made by one maker.
      Erich
      So can you explain the different pin set up's on all three badges ? Are they replacement ?

      Comment


        The 1st and 2nd pattern had different pin set ups. The 2nd pattern had a more robust pin arrangement since the 1st pattern pin/catches often broke. Many 1st patterns you see have replaced pins.

        Gary B
        ANA LM #1201868, OMSA LM #60, OVMS LM #8348

        Comment


          Originally posted by Gary B View Post
          The 1st and 2nd pattern had different pin set ups. The 2nd pattern had a more robust pin arrangement since the 1st pattern pin/catches often broke. Many 1st patterns you see have replaced pins.

          Gary B
          Your not answering the question on the 1st type badge shown by these three Erich S,Erich B,Bob Hritz the pin set up is different.So are they replacements on all three or is Bob's the only original pin set up ?

          Comment


            Erich S' pictured badge is now mine and has a replaced pin and catch. Erich B's appears to have a replaced pin. Bob H has two 1st patterns (1 with the shallow behind the sword) and another standard 1st pattern both with original pins/catches. His other pictured is a 2nd pattern.

            Gary B
            ANA LM #1201868, OMSA LM #60, OVMS LM #8348

            Comment


              Originally posted by Gary B View Post
              Erich S' pictured badge is now mine and has a replaced pin and catch. Erich B's appears to have a replaced pin. Bob H has two 1st patterns (1 with the shallow behind the sword) and another standard 1st pattern both with original pins/catches. His other pictured is a 2nd pattern.

              Gary B

              Comment


                Originally posted by Gary B View Post
                Erich S' pictured badge is now mine and has a replaced pin and catch. Erich B's appears to have a replaced pin. Bob H has two 1st patterns (1 with the shallow behind the sword) and another standard 1st pattern both with original pins/catches. His other pictured is a 2nd pattern.

                Gary B
                So can you explain what appears to be a little box which the catch sits on ?

                Comment


                  Comment


                    It's a small piece of sheet metal. It was easier and safer for a jeweler to solder the catch to the metal rectangle and solder that to the back of the badge.

                    The pin on mine looks the same as Bob H's type 1 but the catch on mine is repaired or replaced.

                    Erich
                    Festina lente!

                    Comment


                      I contacted Stephen (WAF member “sjl”) and asked him what he thought the reason was for the 2nd. Pattern Coburg badges not to have the M/ prefix before the RZM stamp. As you probably are aware, Stephen probably knows more about RZM than any other forum member.

                      His opinion is that these 2nd Pattern Coburg badges were probably produced and stamped in the period after the RZM regulation had come into force but before badge makers had been issued a number. He also thought that badges held in stock might also have been retro-stamped with the RZM stamp.

                      If correct, that would solve the mystery.

                      Stan

                      Comment


                        Hi Stan,

                        Thanks for sharing Stephen's response to your question regarding the RZM, and I completely agree. The organization that became known as the "RZM" came into being in 1929 and it took several years -- and the accession to national power of the NSDAP -- for that organization to fully develop it's processes and it's licensing categories.

                        Br. James

                        Comment


                          According to Clyde Davis, in his "Handbook of RZM Codes, Volume 1 Metal" 1975, page 10: "..the so-called "standard" or "normal" pattern for RZM codes did not come into use until March 1935. Prior to this and the earlier form (MA, Sy, KH, etc. ) some pieces were marked with the company name only and no code, some with only the RZM mark and no code, some with a code number but no prefix (M1, M2, erc.). This would tie in with Stephen's suggestion, so we can assume the badges with the RZM mark/RZM mark with number only were made before March 1935.
                          Erich
                          Festina lente!

                          Comment


                            Spot on, Erich, as is/was Clyde Davis!

                            Br. James

                            Comment


                              There is another one on Weitzes Website.

                              Comment


                                Weitze's piece is at 10k euros.

                                Mil

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