himmler signature

[max history]

**Best thing would be to contact Don Boyle who is the top expert in all things TK ring.

Sorry, but I couldn't resist that. Now I really am out of here.

[pvluger]

Sorry, but I couldn't resist that.

Then perhaps he should be discussing this better with you. You are an expert, are you not? What do you recommend?

[John Pen.]

Max, and everyone else,
Thanks for posting on this thread, your opinions and input is much appreciated. It looks like the thread started getting "personal" with opinions. Oh well.

I think that besides the "significant", "rare" and "important" disagreements(discussion) it seems, as far as "value" goes, to be alot about the difference between "wholesale" or "dealer" pricing as opposed to "retail" price.

The "Old Timers"(sorry) are more connected therefore able to more often get the "insider" prices, while the newer collectors not being as well connected mostly know the "retail" pricing. Also, newer collectors do not have the luxury(or curse) of recalling the "good old days" when prices were realistic and affordable. They came into the market when things are basically out of hand and prices are skyrocketing, that's all they know.
All of this could have alot to do with the difference of opinions.

I think that this discussion could continue if we all realize the there are two generations of collectors here and we respect each other for that fact.

pvluger, with the Don Boyle idea and Thorsten B. with the Hermann Historica Auction House idea, both are great ideas and I'm sure moosie appreciates it.
I also think moosie could pay $25 and try e-stand with some highball price....
you never know who may come out of the woodwork with the cash! Well that's my idea. Any others?

I hope this discussion can continue, as I, personally have met two very special people here.

My friend Max, don't give up on us ornery and uppity novices
You gotta teach us more stuff,,,, for God's sake!

John Pen.

[crfraser]

Auction would seem to be the way to go unless the seller is happy to set a price and receive only that if it sells. Not being a collector, I expect the owner will want to maximize value. Be aware that auction houses charge a significant selling premium and that even auctions are no guarantee of achieving a good price. While by defintion an aucton price is fair value, similar items can sell in different auctions at radically different prices.

One needs to consider timing, jurisdiction or country, echange rates, whether the auction house will attract the number of interested buyers required to stimulate a bidding war, and timing of auctions and consignment. And read the auctioneer's small print. Terms are sometimes negotiable. Finally, I suggest you take the advice of those who have actually sold good pieces at auction and walked away happy.

Good luck.

[pvluger]

Max, and everyone else,
Thanks for posting on this thread, your opinions and input is much appreciated. It looks like the thread started getting "personal" with opinions. Oh well.

I think that besides the "significant", "rare" and "important" disagreements(discussion) it seems, as far as "value" goes, to be alot about the difference between "wholesale" or "dealer" pricing as opposed to "retail" price.

The "Old Timers"(sorry) are more connected therefore able to more often get the "insider" prices, while the newer collectors not being as well connected mostly know the "retail" pricing. Also, newer collectors do not have the luxury(or curse) of recalling the "good old days" when prices were realistic and affordable. They came into the market when things are basically out of hand and prices are skyrocketing, that's all they know.
All of this could have alot to do with the difference of opinions.

I think that this discussion could continue if we all realize the there are two generations of collectors here and we respect each other for that fact.

pvluger, with the Don Boyle idea and Thorsten B. with the Hermann Historica Auction House idea, both are great ideas and I'm sure moosie appreciates it.
I also think moosie could pay $25 and try e-stand with some highball price....
you never know who may come out of the woodwork with the cash! Well that's my idea. Any others?

I hope this discussion can continue, as I, personally have met two very special people here.

My friend Max, don't give up on us ornery and uppity novices
You gotta teach us more stuff,,,, for God's sake!

John Pen.

John, I COMPLETELY agree.
I'm totally interested to see what becomes of Moosie find. I never meant my previous comment to be personal and do believe MAX is an expert with much valuable info to contribute. I merely was trying to help Moosie the best I could as I believe all of us here are trying to.

Max, I'm totally serious when I said I was intersted in your recommendation. Please dont end your contributions with us simply with "I'm outa here."

[max history]

Max, I'm totally serious when I said I was intersted in your recommendation. Please dont end your contributions with us simply with "I'm outa here."

I don't want to give the impression that I'm jumping ship. I just thought, having posted my thoughts, it was time to withdraw as the thread was going nowhere.
Max.

[pvluger]

I don't want to give the impression that I'm jumping ship. I just thought, having posted my thoughts, it was time to withdraw as the thread was going nowhere.
Max.

That's perfectly fine. Any thoughts on the document variations?

[max history]

Documents from the Third Reich vary over the years, as with these examples. In my experience, some earlier documents have RFSS ink stamps, but not all. It is more common to see TK ring documents without. There were also slight variations in print characters over the years.
At the end of the war, many Germans feared that a connection to the SS or the NSDAP would have dire consequences. Hence the obliteration of SS membership on much paperwork, or the secretion of incriminating documents, badges and insignia, etc. My educated guess is that their remains a wealth of material secretly buried in gardens throughout Germany, most of which is now forgotten.
The document at the start of this thread appears to be an authentic piece which was secreted and forgotten. If I were selling it without knowledge of its value, I would obtain a rough guide to valuation from one of the many specialist auction houses or friendly dealers. I would then decide on how much I would accept for it and then offer it for sale. If it went unsold, I would then consider an auction house. Wolfgang Hermann holds two auctions a year, but the commission charges are extremely high and there is no guarantee that the hammer price would be any more than in one of the smaller houses. Consider also one or two autograph houses.
There is also the alternative route, which would be to keep it and have it professionally mounted and framed with a good portrait of Himmler. A good after dinner talking point for many years to come.
Max.

[pvluger]

Fantastic advice! I like the last option best!

[John Pen.]

Fantastic advice! I like the last option best!

In that case, you're lucky you don't live in NYC!!
(I mean because you would have very few dinner guests that wouldn't take offense )

[moosie]

thank you all for your inputs and advice. it has been great fun reading all of your opinions and suggestions.

max--

although i've thought about keeping it, i don't think a pic of himmler is something i would want to display on my wall. i find it to be an interesting document with an interesting background, but it is a reminder of very bad times for many people (including my own family), some of whom are still alive.

i would like to pursue these specialty auction houses and the dealers, but i don't even know how to begin. are they easily enough found on the internet? if anyone here could point me in the right direction, i'd really appreciate it. (i look at any profit from this as kind of reparation money.)

otherwise, i hope to continue reading your discussions!

[John Pen.]

thank you all for your inputs and advice. it has been great fun reading all of your opinions and suggestions.

max--

............ but it is a reminder of very bad times for many people (including my own family), some of whom are still alive.

i would like to pursue these specialty auction houses and the dealers, but i don't even know how to begin. are they easily enough found on the internet? if anyone here could point me in the right direction, i'd really appreciate it. (i look at any profit from this as kind of reparation money.)

otherwise, i hope to continue reading your discussions!

Excellent moosie!
I think you said before that the proceeds will be going to your Mom(ex-slave laborer), right?
Good luck,
and I'll continue to help as time allows,
Best regards,
John Pen.

[moosie]

yes. thank you. have very much enjoyed our "talks"!

[John Pen.]

me too.

[pvluger]

In that case, you're lucky you don't live in NYC!!
(I mean because you would have very few dinner guests that wouldn't take offense )

Lol. I have "survivors" connected to my family by marriage and though it took several conversations, they understand my hobby. My collection includes artifacts from all participating nations in WWII anyhow. Something like this would go nicely next to my band of brothers vet autographs which share a wall also with some Uboat ace autographs as well.