Yes, there it is. Good spot Norm.
John
John
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Looks like the maker mark is also slightly different, the "R" looking more like a "B" in the fakes.
It is interesting that both fake examples are in poor condition of almost no value even if they were both period. That is not to say better examples of the fake do not exist and reside in collections.
We need to be careful with this one if we see it again.
JohnComment
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This may or may not be related to the Fleet badges, but at the very least shows there's a long history of high quality fakes with ball hinges and fakes with an R.S.&S. mark. Apparently the Heer crowd is well aware of these fake PABs as far back as the early 1990's, said to have come from eastern Europe. Identical obverses and cutouts but a variety of reverses including a ball-hinge HA (Hermann Aurich never used a ball hinge) and an R.S.&S. with different setup (Richard Simm never made a PAB).
We're just lucky over here in KM that there was somewhat less interest and marketability to feed the high quality fake producers in the past -- still some of course but probably less than Heer.
Best regards,
---NormComment
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Right, good images Norm. We know that there are fakes in LW and Heer with ball hinges, but so far, this RSS HSF is the only one we have seen in KM, correct?
JohnComment
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What other KM badges are there with ball hinges?
AS S-boat, but no fakes of that with a ball hinge I think.
JFS destroyer
AS MS
RSS HSF
JohnComment
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Thanks for the reply Norm...
Just to add to the discussion about Ball Hinged Fakes...Here is a JFS IAB fake with a ball hinge and crimped in catch.
Best Regards, fischerComment
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And all 3, especially the last one, have the casting marks.
JAndrewComment
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Hi John,Originally posted by John Robinson View Post
That's a good approach, and although I'm not aware of any fakes of the AS S-Boat, there are indeed fakes of the others you mentioned. Besides the Fleet badge in this thread, I'll post the other ball hinge fakes.
First the Staegemeir fake "AS in triangle" Minesweeper.Comment
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fake "unmarked AS".Comment
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and finally, the fake JFS DestroyerComment
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I spoke too soon. But this fake doesn't attempt to duplicate the ball-hinge hardware.Originally posted by Norm F View PostComment
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Getting back to the Fleet badge, here's an interesting comparison. On the top is a detail from the badge from the top of the thread. On the bottom is an example of the Staegemeir "Type 1" fake of the HA Coastal Artillery badge. There you see a casting of a round crimp without a catch and a strikingly similar brownish discolouration of the surface. The general texture of the reverse surface seems similar as well. It makes you wonder if these two badges came out of the same workshop.
(Just a reminder, when we say "Staegemeir fakes" we're referring to badges of the same type that were marketed on his website over the years. We don't know if Staegemeir actually makes the fakes on his site or commissions them or simply sources them from a particular supplier, although occasionally he sells both the fakes and the actual original badge from which it was cast on his website at the same time.)
Best regards,
---NormComment
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Hi Norm
Another Ball Hinge fake/technique some might encounter. This example I found on the infamous Auction list as well.
This MK1 IAB has the crimping area as a separate piece instead of being an integral part of the reverse die.
The crimp and the hinge appears to be one assemblage and looks to be soldered in place.
The catch appears to be made in the same fashion.
Best Regards, fischerComment
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Great discussion.
Thanks
SteveComment
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A couple more high-end fake R.S.&S. badges have surfaced recently. First, this one I believe is from the same source as the IAB posted by Don.Originally posted by fischer View Post
Best regards,
---NormComment
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